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#ruby - 17 November 2015

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[00:13:16] shevy: are there ways to distinguish between downloads of gems?
[00:13:45] shevy: e. g. whether someone did a "gem install name", or downloaded a specific gem, without dependencies, directly via the URL link (like to click on it manually)
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[00:21:38] jackjackdripper: anybody played with dashing/sinatra? I'm having issues with threads not dying
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[00:28:50] jackjackdripper: shevy yeah wish I can just take a chainsaw to it.
[00:29:38] jhass: do it! https://rubygems.org/gems/chainsaw might get you a better grasp on your logs!
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[00:30:22] jackjackdripper: that is awesome
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[00:32:12] Ox0dea: jhass: It's a little weird we don't have libpng 1.6.19, no?
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[00:33:48] jhass: Ox0dea: dunno, I'm rather missing pinentry 0.9.6
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[00:34:50] Ox0dea: Somebody seems to have put a bandage on the edge. :<
[00:35:17] shevy: got another question ... on the page http://www.chaos.org.uk/~eddy/bits/chars.html
[00:35:26] shevy: There are "Greek letters:"
[00:35:59] shevy: so, name | small | big, as in: delta, then the small delta character ?, and then the big one ?
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[00:36:19] jhass: shevy: get a font that displays them?
[00:36:38] shevy: My initial idea was to use DELTA as constant in ruby for the representation of one of those; but I wonder what I should use for the other one... since DELTA would be all upcased already...
[00:37:08] Ox0dea: shevy: Drop down to C so you can name constants however you please. :P
[00:37:18] Ox0dea: >> Complex.constants nil
[00:37:19] ruboto: Ox0dea # => [:compatible, :I] (https://eval.in/469934)
[00:37:23] shevy: I'd still have to give it a name
[00:37:27] Ox0dea: See above.
[00:37:31] Ox0dea: You could name it `delta`.
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[00:39:34] Ox0dea: > assert_equal ????, (ARABIC LIGATURE UIGHUR KIRGHIZ YEH WITH HAMZA ABOVE WITH ALEF MAKSURA ISOLATED FORM).to_s
[00:40:18] Ox0dea: (It passes.)
[00:40:38] shevy: what is this
[00:42:11] Ox0dea: The named Unicode literals thing.
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[00:42:36] Ox0dea: The explicit conversion to String sucks, but I have to maintain a buffer for chaining and potential post-processing.
[00:43:36] Ox0dea: snowmen = SNOWMAN * 3; p BLACK snowmen # => "?????????"
[00:43:50] Ox0dea: It's the best leaky abstraction ever.
[00:45:03] shevy: do they melt when they leak?
[00:45:18] Ox0dea: > assert_raises(NoMethodError) { MELTING SNOWMAN }
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[00:46:51] Ox0dea: Are you ready to be made moderately uncomfortable?
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[00:47:46] Ox0dea: Socks on in the bath.
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[00:52:36] Diabolik: how commonly used is the Marshal class in day to day Ruby?
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[00:54:15] Ox0dea: Diabolik: What's the purpose of your inquiry? You certainly shouldn't have to justify using it if it's the Right Tool.
[00:54:43] Diabolik: im just learning about it and i had never heard of it before which surprised me
[00:54:57] Diabolik: so was wondering if it was considered common knowledge or not
[00:55:18] Ox0dea: No, I wouldn't say it's common knowledge, but seasoned Rubyists certainly know it and have likely used it now and again.
[00:55:30] Ox0dea: It's how RubyGems stores specs, for instance.
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[00:56:38] Ox0dea: https://rubygems.org/latest_specs.4.8.gz
[00:57:01] Ox0dea: See if you can figure out how to read it. :P
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[01:01:01] Diabolik: Ox0dea which would you say are the most useful of the ruby standard library?
[01:01:24] shevy: Diabolik you may not need it often, usually for dumping data to the disk; then again I also found that yaml works fairly good for most of the latter
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[01:03:00] Ox0dea: Diabolik: Insufficient data for meaningful answer.
[01:03:24] Diabolik: im just reading through the docs atm
[01:03:32] Diabolik: and wondering which i should focus on
[01:04:05] Ox0dea: Using gems isn't illegal.
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[01:04:31] haylon: Would anyone be able to help me with Berkshelf, #chef seems to have gone AFK.
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[01:04:48] Ox0dea: Diabolik: For educational purposes, I'd recommend Set.
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[01:06:29] Ox0dea: I vaguely recall there being a lot of the characteristic Japanese weirdness in there, but it seems to have gone.
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[01:20:00] Mon_Ouie: The implementation of OrderedSet if you don't have the rbtree gem is very odd, unless they changed that
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[03:19:30] TheNet: can I use a deploy key in a gemfile for gems that are sourced from a git repository?
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[03:35:27] antoniobeyah: TheNet: i dont think you put keys in the gemfile. as long as you can git clone the repository you should be able to resolve it via a git: url
[03:35:55] TheNet: antoniobeyah: makes sense, thanks
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[03:36:23] antoniobeyah: TheNet: you have have to use the ssh endpoint instead of the https endpoint
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[04:46:55] diegoviola: when parsing/importing CSV data that is separated by a \t, how do I validate it before importing?
[04:47:11] Radar: diegoviola: Is it OK if I kick you without showing code?
[04:47:19] Radar: Like, kick then +b for a day each time you do it.
[04:47:32] Radar: Because imo it's not OK for you to not being show examples of what you mean after you've spent so long in these channels.
[04:47:41] mallu: I'm studying ruby and I'm looking for some "homework" to practice array, hash etc. Any place I can find these?
[04:47:46] Radar: You know the rules and so do I.
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[04:47:54] Radar: We're no strangers to <s>love</s> helping you.
[04:48:10] pontiki: mallu: i'd suggest picking up a CS datastructure text, an old one should be available for really cheap
[04:48:16] Radar: mallu: Ruby Koans.http://rubykoans.com/
[04:48:17] pontiki: maybe lipschitz
[04:48:26] diegoviola: Radar: https://gist.github.com/diegoviola/a421be0e95da5d9accf2
[04:48:28] Radar: http://rubykoans.com/ that is
[04:48:38] Radar: diegoviola: I see no such validation.
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[04:48:48] Radar: diegoviola: Does your CSV not have headers either?
[04:48:48] pontiki: mallu: i'd also suggest a visit to exocism.io
[04:48:49] diegoviola: Radar: yes that's my problem, I don't have any yet
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[04:48:59] Radar: pontiki: exercism.io, you mean?
[04:49:07] jhass: mallu: not focused on array & hash, but excercism.io provides nice tasks, and since those datastructures are at the core of Ruby, you'll come across stuff that needs using them
[04:49:09] pontiki: good grief!! LOL
[04:49:13] pontiki: yes, Radar
[04:49:18] mallu: thank you
[04:49:22] diegoviola: Radar: my CSV has headers
[04:49:29] Radar: diegoviola: Gist your CSV in that same one please.]
[04:49:56] jhass: diegoviola: I think I missed you explaining what you actually want to validate about it?
[04:50:36] Radar: diegoviola: So you should be passing headers: true along with col_sep. Then you don't need to use array indexing to reference the fields in that CSV.
[04:50:38] diegoviola: jhass: if I pass another file I just don't want it to parse
[04:50:44] diegoviola: jhass: or do anything
[04:50:54] jhass: diegoviola: rescue the errors CSV will throw at you?
[04:51:11] Ox0dea: Yeah, use exceptions for control flow!
[04:51:11] jhass: so, just do that?
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[04:51:43] jhass: Ox0dea: of course passing invalid data would be exception! :P
[04:51:51] jhass: *the exception, even
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[04:52:00] Ox0dea: Y'got me.
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[04:59:56] diegoviola: Radar: how I'm supposed to reference it instead
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[05:00:29] Radar: diegoviola: "reference it"?
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[05:00:46] jhass: the world!
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[05:01:01] diegoviola: Radar: you mentioned I don't have to use row[0], etc.
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[05:01:08] Radar: diegoviola: Yes.
[05:01:11] Radar: Did you use headers: true yet?
[05:01:13] Ox0dea: jhass: http://orteil.dashnet.org/nested
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[05:01:17] Radar: If so: experiment for 15 minutes
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[05:01:22] Radar: I'm sure you can figure it out if you try.
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[05:02:28] Ox0dea: ??? It's easy if you try. ???
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[05:05:18] jhass: Ox0dea: I'm disappointed, no universes in the psyche
[05:05:34] Ox0dea: jhass: That is disappointing.
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[05:12:53] VeryBewitching: At least there's a universe in the lint in someone's pocket though.
[05:12:56] VeryBewitching: That's reassuring.
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[05:14:06] pontiki: to see a world in a grain of sand / and heav'n in a wild flower. // hold infinity in the palm of your hand / and eternity in an hour
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[05:15:18] VeryBewitching: I think the mind is an energy form trying to escape the orbit of reality.
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[05:16:25] eam: VeryBewitching: perhaps we are all Boltzmann brains
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[05:16:52] eam: occam's razor suggests it, at least
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[05:18:06] eam: >> Process.kill 9, 123456, $$
[05:18:07] ruboto: eam # => (https://eval.in/469993)
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[05:18:52] eam: welp, can't demo it there, but this is super annoying behavior: kill sig, *pids will fail partway through if any operation returns ESRCH
[05:19:11] eam: which basically means you can never use kill in list form reliably
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[05:30:58] mallu: puts "What is your name?" name = gets.chomp if !name.nil? puts "Hello, #{name}" else puts "Hello,World!" end. why I am only getting "Hello" if i don't specify a name?
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[05:31:36] mallu: hello-world>ruby hello_world.rb What is your name? Hello,
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[05:32:32] Radar: mallu: because name is not nil
[05:32:36] Radar: It's always not nil
[05:33:48] Ox0dea: >> ["".nil?, "".empty?] # mallu
[05:33:49] mallu: so in Ruby nil != empty?
[05:33:49] ruboto: Ox0dea # => [false, true] (https://eval.in/469996)
[05:33:55] Ox0dea: Well, there it is.
[05:35:29] Radar: an empty string is not nil, and nil is not an empty string
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[05:39:15] TheNet_: mallu: gets.chomp always returns a string, and "" isn't nil. what you're looking for is name.empty?
[05:39:31] mallu: ok. thanks
[05:39:35] TheNet_: you should also switch the if and else around to avoid the !
[05:39:45] TheNet_: just the convention
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[05:46:12] Ox0dea: Or use `unless/else`.
[05:48:03] TheNet_: Ox0dea: I think ruby style guide advices against using unless with else
[05:49:09] Ox0dea: I believe I made my awareness of that abundantly clear.
[05:52:17] pontiki: some abundances are more abundant than others
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[05:53:27] pontiki: yeah, i don't know what that means either
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[06:13:00] djellemah: Ox0dea: If you didn't come right yet, that link I sent says it implements tries with reverse lookup https://github.com/lotem/marisa-trie/
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[06:31:08] ChanServ: ChanServ kicked NathanHiggers: Unacceptable nick - http://ruby-community.com/pages/user_rules#rule_2_10
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[06:33:39] shevy: hah - a kick with a link :)
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[06:45:42] mallu: string1 = 'GAGCCTACTAACGGGAT' string2 = 'CATCGTAATGACGGCCT'. What is the best way to find out how many characters are different on these two strings?
[06:45:45] Ox0dea: djellemah: I did miss that part the first time through, but this is definitely geared more toward prediction.
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[06:46:33] Ox0dea: Since MARISA chooses the values, I'd still need to have a map from those back to words, which is exactly what I've got now without a weird dependency.
[06:46:48] mallu: is #scan is the best way to find out ?
[06:47:07] Ox0dea: mallu: Will they always be the same length?
[06:47:24] Ox0dea: Then Levenshtein distance.
[06:47:59] Ox0dea: mallu: To clarify, will `string1` and `string2` always be equal in length?
[06:48:14] shevy: mallu hah Mr. DNA!
[06:48:27] Ox0dea: GATTACA was okay.
[06:48:30] mallu: Ox0dea: no
[06:48:40] Ox0dea: mallu: Are you sure?
[06:48:51] shevy: mallu gem has levensthein
[06:49:03] shevy: >> require 'rubygems/text'"; include Gem::Text; levenshtein_distance 'shevy', 'chevy'
[06:49:03] ruboto: shevy # => /execpad/interpreters/ruby-2.2.0/lib/ruby/2.2.0/rubygems/core_ext/kernel_require.rb:54:in `require': ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470045)
[06:49:12] mallu: Ox0dea: I'm sorry.. yes.. the strings that are comaing will be always same ength
[06:49:24] Ox0dea: mallu: Then #zip and #count would make for a pretty elegant solution.
[06:49:33] shevy: one '"' too much
[06:49:43] Ox0dea: shevy: See? I don't always post useless shit.
[06:49:56] mallu: Shevy; yes..DNA
[06:50:10] shevy: it's the projects Ox0dea!
[06:50:22] Ox0dea: >> s1 = 'GAGCCTACTAACGGGAT'; s2 = 'CATCGTAATGACGGCCT'; s1.chars.zip(s2.chars).count { |a, b| a != b } # mallu
[06:50:23] ruboto: Ox0dea # => 7 (https://eval.in/470046)
[06:50:24] shevy: mallu yay brother \o/
[06:50:46] Ox0dea: It's a shame we can't say `count(:!=)`, but there it is.
[06:51:36] mallu: Ox0dea: a stupid question; I searched all over for the same info and couldn't find it. How do you know all these methods?
[06:51:46] Ox0dea: mallu: I've been doing this a while.
[06:52:04] Ox0dea: But, really, you should set aside some time to go through Enumerable.
[06:52:23] Ox0dea: &ri Enumerable
[06:52:23] `derpy: http://www.rubydoc.info/stdlib/core/Enumerable
[06:52:28] Ox0dea: It's nifty as.
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[06:53:10] mallu: ok.. thanks
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[06:54:36] shevy: mallu he writes weird code all the time so he knows all the things
[06:56:10] Ox0dea: >> (___=->_,__=''{__=_[$.]+__; _[$.+=$$/$$]?___[_,__]:__})['.not od I']
[06:56:11] ruboto: Ox0dea # => "I do ton." (https://eval.in/470049)
[06:56:16] Ox0dea: How embarrassing.
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[06:58:41] shevy: you are obfuscating ruby code
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[07:52:10] Ox0dea: How long until it's socially acceptable to use #dig?
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[07:58:49] Ox0dea: When everybody is magically on 2.3?
[07:59:19] shevy: save for those who are lazy
[07:59:37] shevy: there are people who use ruby 1.8.x!
[08:00:24] Ox0dea: x is invariably 7; people who arrive on Monday and find out they have to use 1.8.3 turn up dead before the weekend.
[08:00:36] Ox0dea: It's all very suspicious.
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[08:09:30] blubjr: oops wrong window
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[08:54:27] MightyMigger: is ruby a good language?
[08:54:30] MightyMigger: i heard ruby is pointless
[08:54:37] MightyMigger: not to troll or anything
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[08:54:51] MightyMigger: i am a beginning programmer and the experienced programmers tell me learning ruby is a waste of time
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[08:57:29] zotherstupidguy: MightyMigger if you are just starting then you should try more than one language, i recommend java and ruby :)
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[08:59:24] MightyMigger: zotherstupidguy: what if i want to learn programming
[08:59:36] MightyMigger: i hear that it's best to be good at one language and then branch off
[09:00:27] blubjr: if you know how to program then the language doesn't matter
[09:00:58] MightyMigger: i don't know how to program
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[09:01:37] Ox0dea: http://i.imgur.com/Ufbr5ej.gif
[09:01:55] blubjr: read the little schemer, then structure and interpretation of computer programs, then make whatever you want to make
[09:02:29] Ox0dea: Okay, Paul.
[09:02:30] MightyMigger: Ox0dea: why is imgur so big?
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[09:02:44] Ox0dea: >> 'imgur'.size # MightyMigger
[09:02:45] ruboto: Ox0dea # => 5 (https://eval.in/470098)
[09:02:45] MightyMigger: i really don't know how to program i am learning right now
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[09:12:44] norc: Ox0dea: I feel like a child who found a box of candy.
[09:12:45] norc: http://ruby-doc.org/stdlib-2.0.0/libdoc/dl/rdoc/Win32API.html
[09:13:17] norc: http://ruby-doc.org/stdlib-2.0.0/libdoc/fiddle/rdoc/Fiddle.html
[09:13:22] norc: Why was all of this hidden to me.
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[09:13:53] Ox0dea: norc: Aye, I know the feeling well. :)
[09:14:04] MightyMigger: why would you use ruby for win32 api when windows is written in c and c++?
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[09:17:01] norc: blubjr: I don't know. I can think of a few langauges that might not be so helpful when just getting started with coding.
[09:17:30] shevy: zotherstupidguy noticed anything about his IRC nick? He is asking for a ban :)
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[09:18:54] Ox0dea: I should apologize; I brought it here by recommending Ruby to somebody in ##programming.
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[09:19:18] norc: See, this is why I am anti social.
[09:19:27] norc: Helps preserve the quality of this channel.
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[09:19:51] blubjr: hi yorickpeterse
[09:19:59] shevy: hi porickyeterse
[09:20:05] norc: hi shevy
[09:20:13] shevy: norc hi Ox0dea
[09:20:19] Ox0dea: shevy: hi blubjr
[09:20:29] shevy: I don't know who is blubjr really
[09:20:35] Ox0dea: He's Paul Graham's son.
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[09:21:50] yorickpeterse: what's the logic behind "blubjr" being a child of Paul Graham?
[09:22:14] norc: yorickpeterse: Blub?
[09:22:52] shevy: hi undeadra
[09:23:10] norc: yorickpeterse: http://www.paulgraham.com/avg.html
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[09:27:00] Ox0dea: It's a remarkably bizarre namesake.
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[09:49:34] zotherstupidguy: anyone used octokit before? how to get a list of project written in ruby?
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[09:50:27] Papierkorb: zotherstupidguy: try search by language on github.
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[09:51:25] zotherstupidguy: is there a difference between a search and a query in general sense of the english word
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[09:51:56] Ox0dea: "Query" is closer to "question" than "search".
[09:52:17] Ox0dea: The noun, anyway, but it follows that "query" the verb is closer to "ask".
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[09:52:53] blubjr: what does ox0dea mean
[09:52:59] zotherstupidguy: i agree, and whoever asks a question, is making the preposition that there is an answer
[09:53:24] bob_f: query vs search is somewhat analogous to what vs where.
[09:53:41] bob_f: But who cares about etymology when we're talking about common understandings of stuff.
[09:53:59] zotherstupidguy: bob_f semantics matter :)
[09:54:06] Ox0dea: Precision matters.
[09:54:22] bob_f: zotherstupidguy: Yes, but better to ask "is there a difference between query vs search in <this particular context>".
[09:54:33] bob_f: You're not being precise if you're asking for general semantic equality.
[09:54:47] zotherstupidguy: i gave it the context of the general sense of the word :)
[09:54:58] bob_f: Yup, not very useful question.
[09:55:03] Ox0dea: bob_f: Do you mean to imply that "search" and "query" are somehow synonymous?
[09:55:22] bob_f: Ox0dea: Nope. I mean to imply that, in some contexts, they may be, as far as any normal human is concerned.
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[09:55:37] Ox0dea: bob_f: Don't "normal humans" perform "search queries"?
[09:55:42] bob_f: My point is that it's not useful to ask about general equivalence if you have a specific use case, because that case could be an edge case.
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[09:55:51] bob_f: Ox0dea: Sure, if you say so.
[09:56:07] bob_f: If you don't have a specific case then it's an odd question to ask to start with.
[09:56:36] bob_f: And if you do, let's just discuss that case, since language is too squiffy to expect any kind of coherence from semantic equality.
[09:56:43] Ox0dea: > squiffy
[09:57:14] solars: hey, does anyone know what could cause this error: wrong status line: "\xA6\xC2\x9D\xC8D\x02\x00\x00HTTP/1.1 200 OK" (http.rb) when making http calls? I don't get it
[09:57:15] zotherstupidguy: i dont have a specific case, i just like to get my terms right
[09:57:26] solars: or how I could debug the whole thing
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[09:57:53] zotherstupidguy: http.rb is where?
[09:57:56] Ox0dea: It's a gem.
[09:58:17] Ox0dea: Er... maybe not; lots of gems have files called "http.rb".
[09:59:01] Ox0dea: Yeah, looks like net/http.
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[09:59:36] zotherstupidguy: solars you should confirm that
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[09:59:56] solars: zotherstupidguy, confirm what?
[10:00:02] Ox0dea: solars: It seems really unlikely that some server is sending you back such a response, so I'm inclined to think you're mutating it somehow.
[10:00:05] zotherstupidguy: is that net/http?
[10:00:18] solars: zotherstupidguy, Ox0dea yes it's net/http
[10:00:33] solars: is there a way I can just dump the whole response string, in raw?
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[10:01:01] zotherstupidguy: can you post some code?
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[10:01:50] solars: zotherstupidguy, it's a wrapper that calls net/http - the OOOR gem (for openerp) so I can't directly provide any code
[10:02:26] zotherstupidguy: monkey patching to the rescue!
[10:02:27] solars: it seems to happen in net/http though, that's why dumping the raw response would probably help to determine if it maybe is a problem of a load balancer that messes up the response, or the server itself
[10:02:40] solars: yeah, trying to find a way to do this
[10:02:51] Ox0dea: solars: It looks like an HTTP/HTTPS mismatch.
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[10:03:26] solars: Ox0dea, the problem is it does not happen all the time
[10:03:38] solars: hmm but it could be a problem of load balancers redirecting
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[10:04:04] zotherstupidguy: it is written in what?
[10:04:06] solars: zotherstupidguy, http://stackoverflow.com/questions/227907/how-do-i-view-the-http-response-to-an-activeresource-request the second answer should probably help for the dump
[10:04:17] solars: zotherstupidguy, sorry?
[10:04:30] zotherstupidguy: what does this stands for \xA6\xC2\x9D\xC8D\x02\x0
[10:04:31] solars: what are you referring to
[10:04:38] Ox0dea: zotherstupidguy: It's this crazy thing: https://github.com/akretion/ooor
[10:04:42] solars: no idea, maybe unicode? or ssl stuff
[10:05:12] zotherstupidguy: i have seen it before, but i dont remmber what it is
[10:05:12] solars: OOOR shouldn't matter, if the exception is raised by net/http already when getting the response
[10:05:12] Ox0dea: I do think it's a misinterpreted packet, but I can't say with certainty.
[10:06:26] solars: hmm or \x looks like hex
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[10:06:39] Ox0dea: Yes, that's how Ruby displays non-printable characters.
[10:06:49] Ox0dea: >> [1, 2, 97].map(&:chr)
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[10:06:50] ruboto: Ox0dea # => ["\x01", "\x02", "a"] (https://eval.in/470176)
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[10:07:25] Ox0dea: So you're getting bytes mixed into the response from... somewhere.
[10:07:27] solars: Ox0dea, so you mean mixed up ssl?
[10:07:36] Ox0dea: Seems a decent possibility.
[10:07:53] solars: Ox0dea, but it looks like it's rather outside, than inside the app
[10:08:00] solars: given the exception at this level
[10:08:13] Ox0dea: This is Ruby; it could be coming from anywhere. :P
[10:08:53] Ox0dea: Just as a temporary thing, you might consider monkey-patching Net::HTTPResponse#read_sock_line to not die and instead just read the rest of the socket.
[10:09:05] Ox0dea: *#read_status_line
[10:09:18] Ox0dea: Which takes one argument, a socket, and validates the first line.
[10:09:49] Ox0dea: But you can make it do whatever you want, because this is Ruby. ^_^
[10:09:54] zotherstupidguy: the charachters are ???????????
[10:10:03] Ox0dea: zotherstupidguy: Says which encoding?
[10:10:11] zotherstupidguy: they are in hexadecemial i converted it into text
[10:10:23] Ox0dea: zotherstupidguy: Again, which encoding?
[10:10:26] adaedra: and it's possibly
[10:10:28] zotherstupidguy: http://www.unit-conversion.info/texttools/hexadecimal/
[10:10:45] adaedra: ignore this
[10:10:45] shevy: a french barbarian!
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[10:10:53] Ox0dea: zotherstupidguy: Raw bytes can be interpreted infinitely many ways.
[10:11:05] adaedra: /ignore shevy
[10:11:10] Papierkorb: How do I force IO#read on $stdin to be blocking? The process which starts the script may put stdin into non-blocking mode it seems
[10:11:11] zotherstupidguy: oh, i thought the universe is small and easy to understand
[10:11:22] Ox0dea: All in good time.
[10:11:45] Ox0dea: Papierkorb: $stdin.reopen?
[10:12:29] solars: Ox0dea, zotherstupidguy one more: wrong status line: "\x1F\x8B\b\x00\x00\x00\x00\x00\x00\x03\x8D\x92\xC1\x92\xC2
[10:12:32] solars: \f\x86\xEF>Eo\x9E*P\x01{`\xF1\x1D\xF6\rR\x1A\x95\x19\e\x1C\xC0\xCE\xEE\xDB\xEB\xAE\xE8\xCE\xB8\xD3\xEA\x89\xF0\xCF\x9F\x8F\x90\xC4l\xBF\x86c5bL>\xD0\xC7R\xAC\xF8rk\x17f\xC0|\b\xFD'\xA6S\xA0\x84W\xE1\x04\x11\x86t\x0F\xAE\xE7\b\xC73Z\x031\xC2\xB75=d\xF8\x13S\x8E\x9E\xF6V\xAF\xA5B\xD0\xBAn]\xC7k!P\xD5\x9D\x83M\xCD\xB9\xE2J\xB7\x8D\x90(\r+f\xC3n\xC9\xF3\xE4\xB9\xE7<\xED\xC24\xCES\xB6\xB2\x91\x92k!\x95a?\xD7\x7F\x9E
[10:12:34] solars: \x92\v\xCE\x853\xE5\x95\xA71x\x87\xD3\xCC\xA2\xF3F\xCBV\xBC\xB4\x15\\u\x80Tu\x88T\xB9@;\x1F\a\xEC\xE7\xAB\xE6\xCF\xD5\xB2\xDF\xEF\eV\x9A\xF1R\x7F\xA7\x03\x93\xCC\xFB\xBC\xD9c\x03\xD8\xF3r\\\x00B\x86\xE8vD\x02\x00\x00HTTP/1.1 200 OK
[10:12:36] solars: to decode :)
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[10:12:38] solars: sorry for the multiline
[10:12:54] Ox0dea: That's definitely interference.
[10:13:00] zotherstupidguy: i am an idiot we already established that, why ask me :)
[10:13:19] zotherstupidguy: what makes it definitely?
[10:13:30] Ox0dea: Well, that's certainly not a proper HTTP response.
[10:13:31] ecksit: hey, what do people use for rubygem documentation? i've got a gem that exposes methods via a client that i would like to display how to use. i like tomdoc but can't see a way for it to generate nice outputted documentation
[10:14:07] Papierkorb: Ox0dea: after reading the docs again, IO#read is supposed to be blocking even if operating on a non-blocking handle
[10:14:10] solars: Ox0dea, hmm yes but how to debug? tcpdump on the server?
[10:14:34] Ox0dea: solars: Or even locally, no?
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[10:14:59] zotherstupidguy: solars if you know the method, you can print self and call super
[10:15:44] Ox0dea: ecksit: The best of both worlds, for some definition: http://rubyworks.github.io/yard-tomdoc/
[10:16:10] ecksit: thank Ox0dea, i'll check it out
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[10:16:16] Ox0dea: ecksit: Sure thing.
[10:16:23] ecksit: zotherstupidguy, i'm not too keen on people needing to know the methods
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[10:17:31] solars: Ox0dea, cannot run it locally unfortunately, it happens on the server mostly..
[10:18:03] solars: Ox0dea, zotherstupidguy the url is specified as https://... have to check if there are other settings for ssl in ooor
[10:18:47] Ox0dea: solars: But you're receiving the packets?
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[10:19:17] solars: Ox0dea, how do you mean?
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[10:19:58] ecksit: Ox0dea, do you know if that can automatically generate using that custom plugin?
[10:20:04] ecksit: say, on push to GitHub
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[10:20:42] Ox0dea: ecksit: It certainly won't prevent you wiring up such a thing.
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[10:21:47] Ox0dea: solars: Well, you've obviously got access to whichever machine is receiving these packets; monitor that box's traffic for anomalies?
[10:21:47] ecksit: will --plugin work for a yardopts file?
[10:22:29] zotherstupidguy: Ox0dea you asking him to use somthing like wireshark?
[10:22:47] zotherstupidguy: solars is a he, right?
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[10:23:04] Ox0dea: Or just tshark, but yeah.
[10:24:13] zotherstupidguy: Ox0dea but isn't it a bit cryptic? does it give a report of faulty packets?
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[10:24:29] solars: Ox0dea, ah yes, that's what I meant with tcpdump on the server (the machine the app is running on)
[10:24:46] solars: zotherstupidguy, he, yes :)
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[10:25:38] solars: Ox0dea, zotherstupidguy can't find anything about how to use ssl with ooor, only http:// examples.. but on the other hand most of the requests work
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[10:36:41] zotherstupidguy: solars i would try to do some logging to findout request/response anomalies, blackbox test it, you have tests?
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[10:39:20] Ox0dea: [guilty silence intensifies]
[10:40:01] zotherstupidguy: solars as Ox0dea suggested maybe tshark is worth a shot, tshark -i 2 -p -w logging.cap host blackboxserver_ip
[10:40:40] zotherstupidguy: tshark -i wlan0 -p -w logging.cap host blackboxserver_ip, if you using laptop
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[10:46:33] solars: zotherstupidguy, I will probably use that yes, it only happens rarely so I will just run it on the server
[10:46:58] solars: in the meantime I will treat the exception as success if the error string contains HTTP STATUS 200
[10:48:36] zotherstupidguy: solaris it depends on whom wrote the server code!! some just 200 anyway
[10:49:03] zotherstupidguy: just send 200 anyway and throw the error message in the body
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[10:49:25] solars: no I mean the exception above just contains messed up status codes, but the status is 200 (at the end of that messed up chars)
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[10:50:25] zotherstupidguy: i can't think of anything else you can do instead atm
[10:51:22] solars: yep me too
[10:51:24] solars: very annoying
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[11:17:30] solars: zotherstupidguy, Ox0dea btw I also found a different entry: wrong status line: "Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2015 16:06:33 GMT"
[11:17:39] solars: very weird
[11:18:57] Ox0dea: solars: That is weird. It must be that something else is writing to this socket, but I couldn't begin to point at a culprit. :<
[11:19:46] solars: very weird yes..
[11:19:56] solars: I'm not sure if it is a problem with multithreading passenger
[11:20:03] solars: as it's a rails app with multiple threads
[11:20:23] Ox0dea: Hardly unheard of. :P
[11:23:02] solars: I could try to synchronize these calls somehow
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[11:24:35] Ox0dea: Were you able to locate them, then?
[11:25:17] solars: I mean the class that makes the calls, not the calls inside ooor
[11:25:31] solars: on the other hand it's just normal http calls I assume..
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[11:26:26] solars: https://github.com/akretion/ooor mentions session proxies
[11:26:45] solars: could eventually be a problem when having multipe processes/threads
[11:27:47] solars: on the other hand.. why would this result in the exceptions above..
[11:29:16] Ox0dea: Because that socket is somehow having extraneous data written to it prior to receiving the actual response.
[11:29:45] shevy: perhaps it has a virus attached!
[11:30:20] Ox0dea: What monster would infect a whole Caturday?!
[11:30:31] solars: Ox0dea, but do you think this could come from ooor? or rather from outside
[11:30:43] solars: not sure how it exactly works, technically
[11:30:52] Ox0dea: solars: It really could be anything, man. :<
[11:31:00] Ox0dea: I don't know what all's going on in your app.
[11:31:05] solars: alright :)
[11:31:25] Ox0dea: It'd be as easy as two separate pieces thinking they're the exclusive owner of some file descriptor.
[11:31:37] shevy: a brother and sister quarrel
[11:31:43] shevy: there is only one cookie
[11:31:52] ruboto: Ox0dea # => 0 (https://eval.in/470234)
[11:31:57] Ox0dea: Einmal ist keinmal.
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[12:13:21] shevy: arup_r what is up with you man! you have become so quiet, is reallife so busy now?
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[12:15:25] arup_r: shevy: yes,, trying to set up my new mac with lot of dev tools,, and it sucks as usual.. now upgrading my OS ,,, hehehe.. Are you using `?` operator in 2.2.3 ? hehehe
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[12:19:57] shevy: in 2.2.3 I think it does not work yet
[12:20:18] shevy: did they not change it again? to &
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[12:21:04] Papierkorb: afaik it's &.
[12:22:24] adaedra: nah, they just changed it to ~!@#$%^&*()_+, to make everyone happy.
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[12:29:52] norc: shevy: Indeed. Matz has spoken and so it happened.
[12:29:58] norc: Now we have to live with &.
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[12:32:35] norc: I mean the fun we could have had with this: foo.a?.?a.foo
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[12:48:50] apeiros: adaedra: I thought they went with .<savely_navigate>method_name, to make it easily readable?
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[12:51:57] shevy: we'll all find out at xmas when we wrap out our ruby present!
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[13:13:12] norc: shevy: I will make sure to hide a Perl inside your present when we do secret santa.
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[13:24:04] adaedra: apeiros: that's it you set $?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!? to true.
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[13:39:26] blubjr: how do i take array difference comparing with ==
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[13:43:07] ytti: blubjr, elaborate?
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[13:43:35] ytti: blubjr, ary1 == ary2 compares if they are equal
[13:44:19] blubjr: arr1 - arr2 removes elements that are eql, i want to remove elements that are ==
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[13:50:13] AimlessRAven: hi guys, i have 1 rails question
[13:50:21] AimlessRAven: ok i add devise gem in my prroject
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[13:50:33] AimlessRAven: evrything is fine, but .. how can i geet current_user.registration_date
[13:50:33] havenwood: AimlessRaven: The #RubyOnRails channel is the best place for Rails questions.
[13:50:46] AimlessRAven: but i cant write there.. i dont know why
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[13:51:07] ruboto: Please join #RubyOnRails for Rails questions. You need to be identified with NickServ, see /msg NickServ HELP
[13:51:13] havenwood: AimlessRaven: /msg NickServ HELP
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[14:16:32] bodgix: Hi. Is it a good practice to trap ctrl+c in the main thread and signal all threads to stop and join them before exiting from the main thread? I'm not really interested in any exception if any were thrown. Can I just exit the main thread?
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[14:19:45] bob_f: bodgix: You should always end threads cleanly.
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[14:31:32] bodgix: thanks bob_f that's probably the safe rule of thumb??? I was just wandering if I know exactly what they're doing, are there any bad consequences of just exiting the main thread. It's not like I'm going to leave any zombie processes or sth???
[14:32:20] bob_f: bodgix: No worse than hard-killing any other process, but if you design your application so that you don't cleanly close threads, at some point you're almost definitely going to want to cleanly close them, and then your architecture might need a major overhaul.
[14:32:39] bob_f: bodgix: When you know stuff is "generally a good idea" it's usually going to bite you in the ass later if you take the easy route. :)
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[14:33:09] bodgix: yeah fair enough :)
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[14:35:19] bodgix: but then that would mean that every well written multi threaded program in ruby would have to trap SIGTERM ??? I'm just wondering if that's the case???
[14:35:39] bodgix: sorry SIGINT
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[14:37:32] jhass: well, both actually
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[14:38:34] bob_f: And not just ruby. :)
[14:39:42] bodgix: :) cool. Good to know
[14:40:35] jhass: I guess if you want to be throughout you should trap SIGQUIT too
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[14:42:08] jhass: but on what kind of cleanup to do there is debatable
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[14:55:21] greg: hi i have learned ruby from eleqouent ruby book now want to contribute some open-source project any easyone for nerds
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[14:57:53] suchness: greg: That's a weird question.
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[14:58:10] suchness: are you experienced or do you just want to play around with something already built?
[14:58:33] jhass: greg: http://www.codetriage.com/
[14:58:41] greg: play around m just student
[14:58:52] suchness: Seems like "i just read my first ruby book" and "let's hack some open source projects" is a weird leap.
[14:59:30] greg: waana to do more in short time:)
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[14:59:48] suchness: greg: The link jhass posted looks interesting
[15:00:01] greg: m looking
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[15:01:31] greg: there are plenty of languges there
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[15:02:50] jhass: just pick ruby projects
[15:04:23] greg: is jruby also comes under ruby as far my knowledge ruby is ruby implementation on java platform
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[15:05:17] jhass: true, but doesn't it reimplement a fair amount of stdlib in Ruby?
[15:05:31] jhass: or is it using rubysl-* stuff too by now?
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[15:06:36] greg: on choosing i got many option like homebrew, rails,compass which one to choose?
[15:06:52] greg: do i need to look every project one by one.?
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[15:10:28] greg: jhass: ?
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[15:14:54] DylanJ: hi guys. is it possible to (in a project using active support) instantiate an instance of Date without all of active_supports additions? Essentially: is it possible to load a vanilla core ruby class without monkey patches?
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[15:20:17] newdan: DylanJ: AFAIK monkey patches are global in scope. New Ruby feature Refinements is supposed to allow it to be localized, but I haven't looked into that myself
[15:20:35] jhass: greg: you should pick something that you find interesting
[15:21:32] jhass: DylanJ: so, no, not if you load all of active_support or want to use it with the patches elsewhere
[15:21:35] greg: i have seen three project till now everyone seems to be equal
[15:21:38] greg: homebrew,jruby,vagrant
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[15:22:32] DylanJ: newdan, jhass. bummer. as i thought. thanks though.
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[15:27:08] adaedra: yorickpeterse: on oga, your doc for migration indicates css selectors are not available yet, but your README state otherwise, is this normal?
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[15:31:42] yorickpeterse: uh, maybe I forgot to update that
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[15:32:05] yorickpeterse: Ah yes, didn't update it
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[15:35:04] adaedra: I was trying to save someone from nokogiri!
[15:35:11] yorickpeterse: oh hm, forgot some other bits
[15:35:25] yorickpeterse: well clearly the solution here is to not write docs
[15:35:29] yorickpeterse: then you also don't have to update them
[15:35:50] adaedra: same with tests: they won't fail if they are not written!
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[15:36:23] yorickpeterse: ok now it should be fixed
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[16:05:32] Veejay: Hello, if I build a URI with URI::HTTPS.build, is to_s the only way to get at the full URL?
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[16:05:58] vnk: guys, can anyone help me understund self method?
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[16:07:08] rob_: vnk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2sgQ38UDVY
[16:07:15] rob_: is really good, iirc
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[16:09:05] havenwood: vnk It's actually a keyword not a method: http://ruby-doc.org/core/doc/keywords_rdoc.html
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[16:12:58] greg: beginning of any ruvy book
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[16:15:51] havenwood: vnk: It's the current object. In a class or module definition it's the class or module. In a method or block it's the object on which the method was called.
[16:16:35] vnk: havenwood: basicly if we do something like this class Blaa, then define method def self.Nova puts "hahah" end
[16:17:09] vnk: havenwood: self will check out in which class that method is defined, in this case Blaa, right?
[16:17:29] havenwood: vnk: In that context `self.nova` is the same as writing `Blaa.nova`. Try it in irb/pry.
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[16:19:43] greg: i guess its mostly used in metaprogramming field
[16:20:17] adaedra: what, self?
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[16:22:19] vnk: adaedra: from what I see its used mostly when we want to define class method?
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[16:24:04] newdan: vnk: Also if you want to call a setter method from another method. x = 3 introduces a new local x, self.x = 3 will call x=() method
[16:24:30] newdan: vnk: Also if you simply want to refer to the current object for any reason in your method. E.g. "return self"
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[16:25:33] vnk: newdan: yeah, cool.. tnx
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[17:37:31] memnon34: Hi. I'm pretty new to Ruby, and I'm trying to understand something. I wrote a method that checks the user input. I assign the input to a variable, but if the input is not valid, I prompt the user and call the method again. Testing out my method, I p out the variable, and here's what I don't understand. Instead of just seeing the user's valid, final input, I get a bunch of values. I'm trying to understand why that happens, but I'm having a hard time
[17:37:37] memnon34: searching for it because I just keep getting articles that show peple how to use gets. Can someone please help enlighten me? Pastie attached. http://pastie.org/10563237
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[17:38:53] shevy: choice = gets.chomp!.to_i
[17:39:01] shevy: get rid of the ! and try again
[17:39:07] jhass: memnon34: well, you print it each time, try adding `p caller` too
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[17:41:02] shevy: I'd also probably use 'case choice; when 1,2' there, where the ; would mean a newline
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[17:43:13] shevy: and to make the output of "p choice" in the else clause of the case when menu
[17:44:17] memnon34: I'm still getting the same when I took off the '!'. P caller shows the name of the method. So @jhass, what the method is doing is p-ing choice each time it's called, and I'm only seeing all those p's when a correct input is made because that ends the loop?
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[17:44:38] memnon34: And thanks for the help guys :) I appreciate the feedback.
[17:44:56] jhass: uh, bye I guess
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[17:45:47] shevy: this is like "I need to use the toilet now!" and a moment later "Never mind bye!"
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[17:48:02] Ox0dea: blubjr: Array#delete uses #==, but it only takes a single argument. :<
[17:48:58] blubjr: ya i rolled one using it
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[17:49:52] Ox0dea: What'dja call it?
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[17:52:08] blubjr: array_difference
[17:52:25] blubjr: and it just takes a test parameter i dont know why the standard one doesn't
[17:52:53] Ox0dea: "Test parameter"?
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[17:53:07] Ox0dea: Also, #sans, #less, and #minus are all better than #difference.
[17:53:55] Ox0dea: blubjr: Array#- with a block would be #reject...
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[17:58:58] blubjr: it uses reject..
[17:59:03] blubjr: i missed a 'now' sorry
[17:59:06] blubjr: whats wrong with difference
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[18:02:20] Ox0dea: If I've understood you correctly, you wrote a method called #difference that does exactly what #reject does?
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[18:04:25] blubjr: no, i wrote array's - that takes a test parameter
[18:04:45] Ox0dea: What is a test parameter? A predicate as a block?
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[18:05:16] Ox0dea: But that's exactly what #reject does.
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[18:05:42] blubjr: incorrect
[18:05:53] Ox0dea: Yeah, sorry, I see how you mean.
[18:06:00] Ox0dea: Other argument's an Array and all that.
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[18:06:15] Ox0dea: Here's my take in case it learns somebody anything: https://eval.in/470568
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[18:07:54] Ox0dea: I like using `&method`.
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[18:13:04] vnk: hey guys, with 'require' we basicly import library?
[18:13:40] jhass: well, technically just a file
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[18:15:02] vnk: jhass: isnt library just a file with bunch of classes?
[18:15:51] jhass: though not everything you can put into a file I would call a library ;)
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[18:22:38] shevy: library sounds mighty noble
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[18:22:45] Ox0dea: >> "#{END{p 42}}"
[18:22:46] ruboto: Ox0dea # => "" ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470592)
[18:22:55] Ox0dea: Well, that went well.
[18:23:24] Ox0dea: I'm pretty sure `BEGIN` is the only thing that can't be interpolated.
[18:23:37] jhass: __END__ does not count I guess
[18:23:53] Ox0dea: I mean, it doesn't do "the right thing", but it's not syntactically invalid either.
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[18:25:27] Ox0dea: Is there no way to check for `__END__` other than `defined?(DATA)` and a wish?
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[18:27:13] gr3yR0n1n: hello all, is this the best place for ruby on rails discussions?
[18:27:21] ruboto: Please join #RubyOnRails for Rails questions. You need to be identified with NickServ, see /msg NickServ HELP
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[18:27:36] TeresaP: If I have a class with some public and some private methods and I want to randomly call one of the public methods, is there an efficient way to do it?
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[18:28:44] eam: Ox0dea: does it not do the right thing? END{} returns nil, yeah?
[18:28:47] jhass: &ri Object#public_send Object#methhods Module#instance_methods @TeresaP
[18:28:47] `derpy: TeresaP: http://www.rubydoc.info/stdlib/core/Object#public_send-instance_method, http://www.rubydoc.info/stdlib/core/Module#instance_methods-instance_method
[18:29:08] Ox0dea: eam: `END` does the right thing in an interpolation; __END__ does not.
[18:29:10] jhass: er, Object#methods
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[18:29:31] TeresaP: Ooh I didn't know about this public_send thing
[18:29:34] Ox0dea: TeresaP: `foo.send foo.methods.sample`
[18:29:48] TeresaP: Was definitely on the right track with Class.public_instance_methods(false)
[18:29:51] Ox0dea: You don't need #public_send in this case since #methods won't contain private methods.
[18:30:19] jhass: I prefer public_send over send whereever possible
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[18:32:05] jhass: to avoid accidentally using private API
[18:32:24] TeresaP: This is amazing
[18:32:32] jhass: but I also use a bit semantically to differently "meta programming" from "workaround for a library insufficiency" stuff
[18:32:44] jhass: er, to differentiate
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[18:33:44] jhass: so when say upgrading a library, send can signal places where non public API is used and thus a higher potential for breakage
[18:35:08] Ox0dea: TeresaP: Whatcha gettin' up to that sending any ol' method is a good idea? :P
[18:35:09] shevy: there are only two things that truly scare me
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[18:35:14] shevy: - method_missing
[18:35:24] TeresaP: 0x0dea I'm writing a monkey test
[18:35:33] shevy: test that monkey
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[18:36:14] shevy: I forgot a third thing... non-standard code written by hanmac or Ox0dea
[18:38:02] Ox0dea: I won't defend eval, but #method_missing can be made perfectly safe.
[18:38:26] Ox0dea: Discipline is required, mind, but with great power and all that.
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[18:39:24] vnk: when we define attr_accessor :job in our class what does that extactly mean?
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[18:39:48] TeresaP: How does public_send and send compare to obj.method(str).call?
[18:39:49] jhass: vnk: def job; @job; end; def job=(v); @job = v; end;
[18:39:51] vnk: okay, attr_accessor help us make variable writable and readable but couldnt we just define variable normaly?
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[18:40:11] jhass: TeresaP: they don't allocate a Method object
[18:40:24] NuckingFiggers: what is a good thing to segregate?
[18:40:59] jhass: vnk: they define methods that you can use to access the variable, note those methods are _not_ private
[18:42:19] TeresaP: jhass who is 'they' in this case? The class?
[18:42:33] jhass: vnk: attr_reader, attr_writer, attr_accessor
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[18:42:37] jhass: er, TeresaP ^
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[18:43:16] TeresaP: jhass I'm not using attr_*
[18:43:31] jhass: TeresaP: oh you meant in response to my earlier they, public_send and send there
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[18:44:11] vnk: jhass: http://pastie.org/10563382 what we couldn't do if we havent defined attr_accessor for job in that case?
[18:44:30] TeresaP: MonkeyGestures.method(:method_name).call doesn't actually do it
[18:45:07] Ox0dea: vnk: You wouldn't be able to say `Person.new(...).name`, or `alice = Person.new(...); alice.job = ...`.
[18:45:07] jhass: vnk: for example you couldn't do Person.new("John", "Worker").name
[18:45:34] Ox0dea: TeresaP: You really should be using #{,public_}send.
[18:45:48] Ox0dea: > A couple of Gs, an R and an E, an I and an N, in the end it will only offend.
[18:45:53] jhass: TeresaP: you probably need an instance of MonkeyGestures
[18:46:02] TeresaP: Ox0dea just trying to understand the differences :)
[18:46:14] TeresaP: ah yeah that would make sense jhass
[18:46:22] jhass: well, you need an instance for either of course
[18:46:34] TeresaP: I have one, was just being dumb
[18:47:00] Ox0dea: >> ['2a'.send(:to_i, 16), '2a'.method(:to_i).call(16)] # TeresaP
[18:47:01] ruboto: Ox0dea # => [42, 42] (https://eval.in/470603)
[18:47:21] jhass: you mean public_send :P
[18:47:27] TeresaP: haha you guys are funny
[18:47:35] Ox0dea: They're functionally equivalent, but the latter is a little wasteful and often proves slightly less malleable.
[18:48:04] Ox0dea: Data > behavior.
[18:48:07] TeresaP: I'll use public_send. It works great
[18:48:09] TeresaP: Thanks so much
[18:48:19] jhass: Ox0dea: let's try it this way: you use send to emulate a regular call right? Does a regular call allow you call a private method (disregarding implicit self for the moment)
[18:48:47] Ox0dea: jhass: I do take your point, but you can't has muh freedumz.
[18:49:50] Ox0dea: That we didn't get "safe send" until 1.9.3 speaks volumes about its having been an afterthought.
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[18:50:07] jhass: so many things are
[18:50:13] jhass: take keyword arguments
[18:50:23] jhass: doesn't make them less preferable
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[18:54:31] mordocai: Anyone using any business rules engines in production successfully? I see https://github.com/ulfurinn/wongi-engine but it is version 0.2.0 and seems like development is slow.
[18:54:43] mordocai: I'm worried mainly about stability
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[19:11:16] norc: Hi. I need to do a project that requires a simplistic GUI. Given my background, I immediately figured Qt would be a good approach. However, the business logic internally is probably much faster to write in Ruby (using some of the gems around).
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[19:11:43] norc: That quickly brought up the idea of running embedded Ruby for the business logic, with Qt dealing with surroundings and events.
[19:11:48] norc: Am I crazy?
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[19:12:26] norc: (The Qt bindings for Ruby that are out there are so horribly outdated and not maintained unfortunately)
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[19:21:48] treehug88: norc yes you are crazy but it could work. I'd look into using a restful api between the two
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[19:25:43] Papierkorb: norc: I did C++/Qt for almost 4 years. You're crazy. Ruby isn't much fun to embed, and Qt isn't fun to access as library. In fact, afaik, there are no viable Qt bindings for Ruby right now.
[19:26:27] Papierkorb: norc: If you want to do scripting, and it doesn't have to be ruby, and you really want scripting (C++/Qt can be quite concise afterall), take a look at Lua. Easy to embed, and quite fast with LuaJit
[19:26:59] Papierkorb: norc: If you like JS (pardon), you could try QML, but I wouldn't want to bet my stuff on it
[19:27:00] skade: Papierkorb norc mruby is an option if scripting should be ruby
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[19:27:24] norc: It just seems that the only viable GUI toolkit that Ruby has decent bindings in is GTK
[19:28:02] Papierkorb: skade: last tried it like 2 years ago. have things changed since then? I remember being able to embed Lua in a single day, without knowing Lua or anything about VMs, but ruby was a huge pain to do anything with
[19:28:19] norc: Meh, well my goal here is to save time on every front.
[19:28:33] norc: And don't get me started on green_shoes or fxruby.... :/
[19:28:47] Papierkorb: fxruby? Is that JavaFX?
[19:29:27] Papierkorb: Oh and before you think "Hey, just use jruby with the Qt java bindings" .. they're like 5 years old now, unmaintained. Sorry, but your toolkit is in another castle Oo
[19:29:28] norc: Papierkorb: No. It's FOX in Ruby.
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[19:30:05] norc: Meh, I really don't want to do amazon AWS stuff with XML handling, embedded sqlite and other things in C++.... :/
[19:30:07] TeresaP: jhass Ox0dea question about that public_send syntax...
[19:30:12] Papierkorb: never heard about fox
[19:30:12] norc: That would really defeat the point of saving time.
[19:30:19] skade: Papierkorb it's used in multiple projects nowadays. mruby is quite small and has a proper embedding API.
[19:30:26] skade: quite a good contender to lua
[19:30:31] vnk: http://pastie.org/10563506 file saved as omg.rb on desktop, I open terminal do cd Desktop then ruby omg.rb and type p1 = Person.new("John")
[19:30:39] vnk: I get error bash: syntax error near unexpected token `('
[19:30:41] Ox0dea: norc: mruby is a decent option, but Ruby itself is perfectly embeddable.
[19:30:44] Ox0dea: It's heavy, though.
[19:30:46] TeresaP: If I want to call a method where I set the parameter if the user hasn't set it, is there a way to use public_send without passing a parameter?
[19:30:51] norc: skade: Well mruby at least seems to be actively maintained by matz, so that certainly speaks for it.
[19:31:11] Ox0dea: TeresaP: `send(foo || :default)`
[19:31:26] jhass: TeresaP: public_send(foo || :default)
[19:31:30] shapeshifter: Is there some sort of short-hand or null-coalescing operator to do something only if the callee is not nil? In my case, I want to do somecollection.find { false }.aProperty each ... and not crash when find returns nothing.
[19:31:46] norc: Shapeshifter: .try()
[19:31:50] Ox0dea: Shapeshifter: &.
[19:31:55] TeresaP: Interesting
[19:31:56] norc: Shapeshifter: Or wait for ^--
[19:31:56] skade: norc yes, it is. also JRuby has reimplemented their launcher using it: https://github.com/jkutner/mjruby
[19:31:58] jhass: norc: try is activesupport
[19:32:00] havenwood: A pretzel tail!
[19:32:04] norc: jhass: Oh really. :D
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[19:32:41] norc: jhass: Sometimes I forget that not every question here arises from Rails development.
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[19:33:08] havenwood: Shapeshifter: With Ruby 2.3's release this Christmas there'll be a new safe navigation operator.
[19:33:14] nofxx: Why is osx so slow? Rails app here 11s load oSX, 2s load linux. osx is i5 , linux i7 but that should be so far away...
[19:33:20] nofxx: ruby from brew, same version all...
[19:33:51] norc: nofxx: I have never experienced any such issues under OSX.
[19:34:01] Papierkorb: norc: heh, we're doing cluster manamgent with ruby at the comp I work at. "Ruby makes the developers happy" (+ even outside webdev), 10/10.
[19:34:03] norc: nofxx: Have you profiled it?
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[19:34:26] havenwood: Shapeshifter: nil&.safely_safely #=> nil
[19:35:05] Ox0dea: nil&.nil? #=> nil
[19:35:24] Ox0dea: >> foo = [1,2,3]; foo.map!(&:itself)
[19:35:25] ruboto: Ox0dea # => [1, 2, 3] (https://eval.in/470630)
[19:35:27] Ox0dea: Should that be `nil`?
[19:35:29] havenwood: >> require 'ripper'; Ripper.tokenize 'nil&.nil?'
[19:35:30] ruboto: havenwood # => ["nil", "&", ".", "nil?"] (https://eval.in/470631)
[19:35:34] shapeshifter: Thanks, but how do I apply this after find { }? something like find { }&.property doesn't work
[19:35:36] TeresaP: Ox0dea or jhass I'm still missing something, I think. Any idea where there might be some more documentation on that send/public_send syntax?
[19:35:41] Ox0dea: Shapeshifter: You're actually on 2.3?
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[19:35:46] havenwood: In 2.3: #=> ["nil", "&.", "nil?"]
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[19:35:56] norc: jhass: The implementation is small enough to copy paste it into ones own codebase though, until we get &.
[19:36:04] Ox0dea: TeresaP: I think maybe you want #curry.
[19:36:06] shapeshifter: Ox0dea: 2.2.3
[19:36:19] havenwood: Shapeshifter: No Ruby 2.3 'till Christmas.
[19:36:21] norc: Shapeshifter: http://api.rubyonrails.org/classes/Object.html#method-i-try -- you could just take that implementation
[19:36:22] Ox0dea: Shapeshifter: Then you don't have `&.` and will need to use something like AS's #try.
[19:36:45] jhass: norc: well, .try! is closer to .?
[19:37:17] Ox0dea: >> foo = '42'.method(:to_i).curry; [foo[10], foo[16]] # TeresaP
[19:37:17] ruboto: Ox0dea # => [42, 66] (https://eval.in/470632)
[19:37:33] Ox0dea: I'm not sure if that actually gets you closer to whatever madness you're wanting to achieve, but it's neat either way.
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[19:37:50] norc: jhass: Considering how much they changed their mind already, Im willing to wait and see until I get a build.
[19:37:50] jhass: wait, .? was changed to &. ?
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[19:37:56] norc: jhass: Yes.
[19:37:56] havenwood: jhass: yup yup
[19:37:58] Ox0dea: jhass: Some time ago.
[19:38:03] norc: jhass: Its actually good.
[19:38:04] Ox0dea: It's better.
[19:38:12] jhass: it's all ugly
[19:38:16] Ox0dea: You stop that.
[19:38:23] shapeshifter: an it's hard to google for these operators...
[19:38:31] jhass: Shapeshifter: symbolhound.com
[19:38:41] vnk: http://pastie.org/10563506 file saved as omg.rb on desktop, I open terminal do cd Desktop then ruby omg.rb and type p1 = Person.new("John")
[19:38:44] vnk: I get error bash: syntax error near unexpected token `('
[19:38:47] vnk: anyone have idea why?
[19:39:16] norc: Shapeshifter jhass> https://bugs.ruby-lang.org/issues/11537
[19:39:21] norc: (for reference)
[19:39:28] nofxx: norc: gonna try to investigate more... but I must say.. not just ruby. Browsing and opening stuff, linux is just way faster
[19:39:34] Ox0dea: Shapeshifter: Perhaps a little more relevant: http://ruby-operators.herokuapp.com/
[19:39:45] Ox0dea: Most Ruby operators have affectionate names that're easier to search for.
[19:39:49] nofxx: not to mention osx doesn't support my mouse... even with logitech driver there's a bug for years with hidpi mouse
[19:39:59] TeresaP: That's...interesting
[19:40:00] norc: nofxx: Definitely should. I have not experienced any issues so far at all, and I have an oldish Macbook Air.
[19:40:01] nofxx: norc: which profile way you mean?
[19:40:03] TeresaP: Maybe I'd better give an example
[19:40:04] shevy: <jhass> it's all ugly
[19:40:04] shevy: <Ox0dea> You stop that.
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[19:40:22] norc: Ox0dea: The best place as we have established though, is the damn source code. :-)
[19:40:22] shevy: today is IRC quotes day!
[19:40:29] Ox0dea: >> (___=->_,__=''{__=_[$.]+__; _[$.+=$$/$$]?___[_,__]:__})['.lufituaeb si ybuR']
[19:40:30] ruboto: Ox0dea # => "Ruby is beautiful." (https://eval.in/470633)
[19:40:41] Ox0dea: No matter what they say.
[19:40:51] Ox0dea: norc: It is known. :)
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[19:41:46] norc: Ox0dea: Tomorrow I'll hunt for the implementation that makes instance and class variables work. Silly dispatch based on variable names - the thought really amused me.
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[19:42:38] shevy: >> RUBY_VERSION
[19:42:39] ruboto: shevy # => "2.2.0" (https://eval.in/470634)
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[19:42:57] Ox0dea: norc: It's easy enough to enable decorators in Ruby, but I wanted to perfectly emulate Python's @foo syntax. It can't be done from Ruby, but I've been meaning to look into doing it from C. ^_^
[19:42:57] shevy: I dread the day when &. will be available for ruboto
[19:43:06] Ox0dea: Essentially, I need `@foo` to be a method call.
[19:43:12] Ox0dea: I bet it's possible.
[19:43:17] norc: Ox0dea: Oh that is actually one of the things that I wish we had in Ruby. :)
[19:43:23] Ox0dea: norc: We do.
[19:43:32] TeresaP: Ox0dea jhass https://eval.in/470635
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[19:43:48] Ox0dea: Method definition returns the name of the method just defined, and that's enough for a decorator to do everything it needs to.
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[19:44:10] TeresaP: I'm using eval.in incorrectly, probably. But bear with me :)
[19:44:15] norc: Ox0dea: o_o
[19:44:15] Ox0dea: norc: Here's a first brush: https://eval.in/470636
[19:44:18] shevy: you like monkeys
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[19:45:25] jhass: TeresaP: you reimplemented Array#sample, but nothing wrong with the public_send call
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[19:45:31] vnk: guys, can anyone help me with error I get when I try to run my ruby script? :P
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[19:45:41] TeresaP: jhass orly
[19:45:44] norc: vnk: That depends on the error you get. And the script.
[19:45:52] Ox0dea: norc: In short, Module#prepend is pretty nifty.
[19:46:01] vnk: norc: http://pastie.org/10563506 file saved as omg.rb on desktop, I open terminal do cd Desktop then ruby omg.rb and type p1 = Person.new("John")
[19:46:05] vnk: norc: I get error bash: syntax error near unexpected token `('
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[19:46:34] Ox0dea: vnk: You're conflating Ruby with IRB.
[19:46:37] norc: Ox0dea: That looks pretty nifty.
[19:46:41] TeresaP: jhass whoops.
[19:46:55] havenwood: vnk: Bash is bad at running Ruby code.
[19:46:56] Ox0dea: vnk: `ruby omg.rg` just runs your script and then exits, so you're typing `p1 = ...` at your shell, not into a Ruby interpreter.
[19:47:13] Ox0dea: vnk: Say `irb -r ./omg` instead.
[19:47:20] Ox0dea: And then embrace Bundler.
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[19:49:25] vnk: Ox0dea: working.. thanks a lot
[19:49:44] Ox0dea: vnk: Sure thing.
[19:52:52] Papierkorb: Can someone recommend a XMPP/Jabber client-side library for ruby for writing a bot?
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[19:54:18] vnk: when its smart to define method in ruby like private one?
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[19:54:45] havenwood: Talk on Ruby 2's methods streaming now: http://confreaks.tv/videos/rubyconf2015-live-stream
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[19:55:18] Ox0dea: vnk: When the method is only intended for internal use.
[19:55:26] Ox0dea: (Which should be never. :P)
[19:55:35] vnk: Ox0dea: lol :D kay
[19:57:11] vnk: wouldnt private methods be somehow similar to class methods? by possible scope of using?
[19:57:18] vnk: nah.. my mistake
[19:57:25] Ox0dea: Yeah, not really.
[19:58:29] Ox0dea: It's about hiding implementation details, not scope.
[20:00:35] havenwood: Up next, self-balancing robot with mruby.
[20:00:44] Ox0dea: How goes the painting?
[20:01:11] j416: havenwood: then the GIL kicks in and your robot falls. lol
[20:01:37] Ox0dea: Alternatively, GC.disable and it becomes a crawler.
[20:02:15] Ox0dea: havenwood: I realize now that you weren't referring to this: http://www.twitch.tv/instapainting
[20:02:32] havenwood: Ox0dea: Aha, I was wondering!
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[20:03:00] shevy: GIL kills :(
[20:04:30] cgfbee: has joined #ruby
[20:04:36] norc: shevy: I once spend like a week debugging a rare race condition that ended corrupting my entire stack each time. Since then I embrace languages that don't let me do unsafe things.
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[20:05:14] havenwood: Speaking of mruby, the third release (1.2.0) is out today!
[20:05:28] havenwood: (And it has no GIL, since no pesky threads.)
[20:06:13] Ox0dea: norc: I guess you've not seen any of the madness I get up to with Fiddle. :P
[20:06:31] djellemah: I'm working with collections of size ??1000 items. Before I go write benchmarks, any feel on the fastest way to build a Hash? Hash[*ary], ary.to_h, ary.each_with_object(Hash.new){...} ?
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[20:06:40] shevy: norc you use java?
[20:06:50] Ox0dea: djellemah: I'd guess #to_h.
[20:06:55] norc: Ox0dea: Right now I think I may have found a bug.
[20:07:00] Ox0dea: norc: I believe it.
[20:07:10] shevy: nobu does not
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[20:08:50] havenwood: Ruby hasn't had a GIL since 1.8. :P
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[20:10:17] Ox0dea: Pronounced "gavel" because matz will be the judge of how much parallelism you really need.
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[20:14:50] norc: >> puts Struct.new(:v) { def m; v = v; end }.new(1).m.nil? # Ox0dea
[20:14:51] ruboto: norc # => true ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470640)
[20:15:21] norc: Before I spend any more time breaking my head, is there something obvious Im missing?
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[20:16:21] grill: let's say I have a method that adds params to a file. Let's also say that some of the params can be optional.
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[20:17:33] djellemah: norc: maybe you mean v == v ?
[20:17:41] norc: No. I actually mean the assignment operator.
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[20:18:29] norc: >> puts Struct.new(:v) { def m; a = v; v = a; end }.new(1).m.nil?
[20:18:30] ruboto: norc # => false ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470645)
[20:18:31] djellemah: >> Struct.new(:v) { def m; v = self.v; end }.new(1).m # norc
[20:18:32] ruboto: djellemah # => 1 (https://eval.in/470646)
[20:18:40] norc: This smells like a bug.
[20:18:49] Ox0dea: >> def foo; 42; end; foo = foo # norc
[20:18:50] ruboto: Ox0dea # => nil (https://eval.in/470648)
[20:18:57] Ox0dea: It's only a bug if that's a bug.
[20:19:05] grill: The method generates config information via %{ somestuff }. How can I omit params if their values are not speficified (e.g. IdentityFile) http://pastebin.com/NdvVCKen
[20:19:05] ruboto: grill, we in #ruby do not like pastebin.com, I reposted your paste to gist for you: https://gist.github.com/3f9a358c52ef13ab2850
[20:19:05] ruboto: pastebin.com loads slowly for most, has ads which are distracting and has terrible formatting.
[20:19:08] norc: Now that you kinda mention it.
[20:19:15] grill: ruboto i do not like you.
[20:19:38] Ox0dea: norc: I'm not sure you actually want `v = v` to be `v = v()`.
[20:19:57] havenwood: ?ruboto grill
[20:19:57] ruboto: grill, I'm the channel bot, linker of the rules, adept of the facts, wielder of the banhammer.
[20:20:36] grill: havenwood are you trying to tell me that ruboto is some kind of robot? i don't think so.
[20:20:38] shevy: havenwood what is a GVL? global VM lock?
[20:20:52] shevy: grill come on man ...
[20:20:58] Ox0dea: What is a rhetorical question?
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[20:21:04] norc: Ox0dea: Yeah nevermind. I was just thinking I had instance variables there for a few minutes...
[20:21:12] Ox0dea: norc: You do.
[20:21:22] grill: The method generates config information via %{ somestuff }. How can I omit params if their values are not speficified (e.g. IdentityFile) http://pastebin.com/NdvVCKen
[20:21:22] norc: Ox0dea: Well, it is accessor methods.
[20:21:22] ruboto: grill, as I told you already, please use https://gist.github.com
[20:21:31] Ox0dea: norc: Which are implemented in terms of instance variables.
[20:21:32] vnk: this is more ruby on rails question but how you guys see ruby on rails job market in next few years?
[20:21:34] havenwood: grill: You are angering ruboto. Be careful.
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[20:21:45] ruboto: vnk, Please join #RubyOnRails for Rails questions. You need to be identified with NickServ, see /msg NickServ HELP
[20:21:49] norc: Ox0dea: Absolutely. The difference is important though. :)
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[20:21:56] Ox0dea: Yes, it is.
[20:21:56] grill: it's fine. so, how can this be done?
[20:22:05] grill: i can't put a conditional in a string, can i?
[20:22:24] Ox0dea: grill: If you've got `nils`, use #compact. If you're got empty strings, `reject(&:empty?)` or some such.
[20:22:39] Ox0dea: You can put virtually anything in a String.
[20:22:46] shevy: even cats?
[20:22:52] Ox0dea: >> "#{def foo; 42; end}#{foo * 2}"
[20:22:53] norc: Ox0dea: Why does that code compile at all though?
[20:22:54] ruboto: Ox0dea # => "foo84" (https://eval.in/470652)
[20:23:13] djellemah: >> "hello #{if true then 'grill' else 'um' end}"
[20:23:14] ruboto: djellemah # => "hello grill" (https://eval.in/470653)
[20:23:17] Ox0dea: norc: Ruby locals spring into existence as soon as they're mentioned.
[20:23:29] grill: that's convenient
[20:23:59] havenwood: shevy: Yup VM. Definitely cats.
[20:24:17] norc: Ox0dea: Why does ruby decide that foo now is a local variable though, when it knows foo to be a method?
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[20:24:38] norc: ACTION hides from the "because Matz said so"
[20:24:41] Ox0dea: norc: Because it doesn't; it can be both simultaneously.
[20:24:50] norc: Ox0dea: You misunderstand.
[20:25:01] Ox0dea: I'm not sure I do.
[20:25:13] Ox0dea: This is just one of the "adverse" effects of paren-less invocation.
[20:25:29] grill: i hate low-quality streams
[20:25:30] havenwood: grill: doll
[20:25:37] shevy: norc one has to get the priority no?
[20:25:38] norc: Ox0dea: I mean so there must be some cache for the lookup for Ruby to decide whether to invoke the method or get the instance variable.
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[20:25:44] Ox0dea: grill: I knew your nick was a Twitch reference!
[20:26:02] grill: Ox0dea wait what
[20:26:18] Ox0dea: grill: Is it not, then?
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[20:26:35] grill: it's way easier than that. instead of "i'm a real girl," i'm a real grill
[20:26:42] Ox0dea: Yes, Twitch started that.
[20:26:50] shevy: you are a geek Ox0dea admit it
[20:27:00] grill: twitch stole it from me
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[20:27:18] havenwood: like an old English brid?
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[20:27:21] grill: twitch stole it from the internet though
[20:30:10] grill: is this valid #{if @auth_file then "IdentityFile #{@auth_file}"}
[20:30:17] Ox0dea: ?try grill
[20:30:17] ruboto: grill, Why don't you try it and see for yourself?
[20:30:25] shevy: you are missing an end there
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[20:30:45] havenwood: grill: Familiar with Ruby's REPLs?
[20:30:45] shevy: you could use a method that will return the proper string
[20:30:49] grill: there we go. thanks.
[20:31:05] Ox0dea: Yeah, you could.
[20:31:18] havenwood: grill: Ruby ships with `irb` or a popular alternative is `pry` which you can install with `gem install pry`.
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[20:31:37] shevy: we could have a shell called "try"!
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[20:31:45] norc: Ox0dea: Nevermind, Im going back to the parser to figure this one out. :)
[20:31:47] Ox0dea: >> "#{nil}" # grill: `nil` interpolates to the empty string, for what it's worth.
[20:31:48] ruboto: Ox0dea # => "" (https://eval.in/470672)
[20:31:58] Ox0dea: norc: It's not always in the parser!
[20:32:04] norc: Ox0dea: I shall see.
[20:32:09] norc: I want no spoon feed.
[20:32:09] grill: that's annoying
[20:32:11] havenwood: grill: In your terminal try `irb` then some Ruby. You can exit it with `exit`.
[20:32:12] Ox0dea: Godspeed.
[20:32:15] grill: thanks for the heads up
[20:32:28] norc: I will let you know if I survive this dive - if not let my family know.
[20:32:32] grill: learn something new every day
[20:32:45] norc: Tell them of my heroic deeds.
[20:33:03] djellemah: norc: adieu and bon chance.
[20:33:14] grill: http://www.indeed.com/salary/q-Ruby-On-Rails-Developer-l-San-Francisco,-CA.html
[20:33:18] grill: is this for real
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[20:34:02] shevy: you pay extra for hipsters
[20:34:10] grill: and startup bros
[20:34:16] grill: can't forget the startup bros
[20:34:18] jhass: grill: now google the rents
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[20:34:41] grill: yeah. isn't it like $3k/mo for something that isn't a closet?
[20:35:08] grill: i want to move to SF so bad, but 36k/yr for rent hurts
[20:35:12] bradland: don't let the notion of a good salary draw you in to the SF startup land
[20:35:18] bradland: be sure a startup is what you want to do first
[20:35:29] grill: yes. i'm on my 3rd one right now
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[20:36:41] shevy: everyone wants to california - havenwood already is there!
[20:36:56] grill: a few of my buds from college are there now
[20:37:09] grill: they keep telling me i have to come out
[20:37:23] zotherstupidguy: gems similar to rugged?
[20:37:34] zotherstupidguy: any gems similar to rugged ?
[20:37:40] Ox0dea: zotherstupidguy: What's wrong with Rugged?
[20:37:55] grill: too mainstream
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[20:39:53] zotherstupidguy: Ox0dea just checking if there is somthing better? rugged is used by github?
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[20:40:17] adaedra: what's the link
[20:40:33] zotherstupidguy: https://github.com/libgit2/rugged
[20:40:48] havenwood: zotherstupidguy: Use Rugged. ;)
[20:41:05] zotherstupidguy: havenwood allrighty then ;)
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[20:41:09] adaedra: that was not what I was asking, but that may be due to a bad english again.
[20:41:39] zotherstupidguy: havenwood is in cali?
[20:42:09] havenwood: zotherstupidguy: LA
[20:42:27] zotherstupidguy: nice! i am going kharkiv soon
[20:42:45] zotherstupidguy: LA is more dangrous :)
[20:45:25] Ox0dea: zotherstupidguy: Well, there's this: https://www.ruby-toolbox.com/categories/git_Tools
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[20:47:20] zotherstupidguy: Ox0dea thanks, great! :)
[20:47:32] Ox0dea: zotherstupidguy: Use Rugged. :P
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[20:51:47] Ox0dea: > warn 'foo must be installed to run its tests.'
[20:52:02] grill: hey. does file.open() need a canonical path?
[20:52:10] ruboto: Why don't you try it and see for yourself?
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[20:52:22] Ox0dea: You really ought to've gotten the hang of this by meow.
[20:52:29] grill: i did just try, and i have no idea where the feel is
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[20:52:57] Ox0dea: You have cat to be kitten me.
[20:53:29] shevy: grill it has to be File.open(); you also must supply an argument to open(), it is mandatory
[20:54:02] Ox0dea: shevy: Our "to be"s aligned.
[20:54:05] grill: wait. are you telling me that i have to acrually give it the name of the file i want to open?
[20:54:17] grill: wtf kind of language is ruby? why doesn't it just know?
[20:54:24] Ox0dea: /ignore add grill
[20:54:52] Ox0dea: I swear my slash key has a lower repeat delay than all the others.
[20:55:20] shevy: Ox0dea you notice things nobody else notices
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[20:55:47] grill: this is very strange
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[20:58:18] norc: Ox0dea: This has to happen at parse stage.
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[21:00:33] norc: >> Ripper.sexp('f; f=1; f')[1].values_at(0,2).map(&:first)
[21:00:34] ruboto: norc # => uninitialized constant Ripper (NameError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470673)
[21:00:35] norc: The proof.
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[21:00:44] norc: >> require 'ripper'; Ripper.sexp('f; f=1; f')[1].values_at(0,2).map(&:first)
[21:00:45] ruboto: norc # => [:vcall, :var_ref] (https://eval.in/470674)
[21:01:41] Ox0dea: norc: That just shows that methods are tried first?
[21:02:06] norc: Ox0dea: It shows that the information whether Ruby considers it a method or a variable is in the AST>
[21:02:07] norc: That was my point.
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[21:02:17] Ox0dea: Ah, right.
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[21:03:06] Ox0dea: I don't see how `foo = foo` could be made to Do the Right Thing in the general case, though.
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[21:04:00] Ox0dea: Consider the very simple case of `foo = foo.bar`; is that essentially an in-place modification or a method call?
[21:05:16] norc: Ox0dea: https://github.com/ruby/ruby/blob/trunk/parse.y#L8974-L8994
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[21:06:23] norc: So whatever magic this is glued to makes things happening.
[21:06:39] norc: That seems to be a technically accurate description of what goes on.
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[21:07:43] Ox0dea: I do see that things happens in that block.
[21:08:18] norc: Told you it was accurate.
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[21:09:57] zotherstupidguy: is there a way to script eamcs with ruby instead of lis
[21:10:20] Ox0dea: Why would you do that?
[21:10:53] zotherstupidguy: Ox0dea cause i don't know much lisp :)
[21:11:41] norc: zotherstupidguy: There. You can type paranthesis. That really is all there is to it.
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[21:14:08] norc: Ox0dea: https://github.com/ruby/ruby/blob/trunk/parse.y#L10228-L10254
[21:14:13] norc: There. Thats it. :)
[21:14:26] norc: Now I can go to bed and sleep.
[21:14:34] blubjr: wanting to extend emacs in anything other than elisp is pretty reasonable
[21:14:58] Ox0dea: norc: Well, there it is. Now what needs fixed again?
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[21:16:10] Ox0dea: >> class<<self;undef to_s end;def method_missing(m,*a)a.shift.send(m,*a)end; to_i(reverse(to_s(123, 13))) # zotherstupidguy
[21:16:11] ruboto: Ox0dea # => 69 (https://eval.in/470678)
[21:16:35] Ox0dea: I should've put the outermost parens. :<
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[21:19:44] norc: Ox0dea: Nothing I suppose. I just fell into the trap of the parsers cache deciding between VCALL and LVAR - but it was so dark I didnt know where I was. :(
[21:20:03] Ox0dea: norc: Well, we're all very happy you managed to find the switch.
[21:20:30] norc: Is there some "Beware the dragons" sign in the official Ruby docs about this?
[21:20:56] norc: I mean I never came into the temptation of knowingly using a local with the same name as a method.
[21:21:02] grill: have i formatted these flags incorrectly? http://paste.ubuntu.com/13318145/
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[21:22:34] Ox0dea: > In Ruby local variable names and method names are nearly identical. If you have not assigned to one of these ambiguous names ruby will assume you wish to call a method. Once you have assigned to the name ruby will assume you wish to reference a local variable.
[21:22:40] Ox0dea: norc: From doc/syntax/assignment.rdoc.
[21:23:34] norc: Ah. Fair enough, I deserve to be smiled at.
[21:23:49] norc: And since Im still awake asking the silly questions.
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[21:24:24] norc: >> F = 1; F = 2
[21:24:25] ruboto: norc # => /tmp/execpad-598c58ee7eb9/source-598c58ee7eb9:2: warning: already initialized constant F ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470683)
[21:24:32] norc: Why does Ruby let me change constants.
[21:25:21] Ox0dea: Because it loves you.
[21:26:09] norc: I mean it actually made me wonder whether there was a way to unfreeze objects too while we are at it..
[21:26:28] adaedra: &ri Object#unfreeze
[21:26:29] `derpy: No results
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[21:26:57] Ox0dea: norc: Ha! About that...
[21:27:20] Ox0dea: norc: https://eval.in/468965
[21:27:37] norc: Ox0dea: Haha, I so did see this coming.
[21:28:02] VeryBewitching: Nothing is truly immutable.
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[21:28:24] Ox0dea: VeryBewitching: FrozenCore is since 2.2. :(
[21:28:55] Ox0dea: nobu committed a patch that just completely elides any class information, so you can't invoke any methods on it.
[21:29:18] Ox0dea: You can just barely get hold of it, and then that's it. :/
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[21:29:37] Ox0dea: norc: Also fun: https://eval.in/460962
[21:30:15] VeryBewitching: https://github.com/charliesome/frozen_core
[21:30:19] Ox0dea: Yep, that one.
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[21:30:55] Ox0dea: The accompanying talk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBdqCYKWISU
[21:31:30] Ox0dea: tl;dw: http://i.imgur.com/EUPmlM9.png
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[21:38:29] grill: have i formatted these flags incorrectly? my code is not showing the config file value when i try to print it http://paste.ubuntu.com/13318145/
[21:39:10] grill: if I set it to something in the initializer, it doesn't change even though I pass something different in through the commandline
[21:39:15] grill: what's going on here
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[21:42:33] adaedra: may we have the full code? It seems you're inside a class, since you use @var
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[21:43:34] grill: yes, i am
[21:44:19] adaedra: It's optparse, right? I just tried with a sample and it worked, so it may be a problem above
[21:45:42] shevy: the problem is that grill is fake
[21:46:32] grill: adaedra http://hastebin.com/uqewakehub.rb
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[21:49:13] adaedra: grill: And I guess that it's the value printed l37 that makes you say it's not parsed correctly
[21:49:40] grill: adaedra that and it raises an exception
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[21:49:49] grill: a missingargument exception
[21:49:51] grill: for all three
[21:50:01] adaedra: Well, that's normal
[21:50:29] grill: in what context?
[21:50:31] grill: i am supplying arguments
[21:50:35] adaedra: The code in this do block (beginning l.18) is executed before the actual parsing, I would say
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[21:51:10] grill: that's extremely annoying
[21:51:17] slash_nick: it's a flower garden
[21:51:30] adaedra: You have to check for your arguments after the call to parse!
[21:51:43] adaedra: goodbye, slash_nick
[21:52:00] slash_quit: ACTION hangs head very low
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[21:53:27] Melpaws: when i'm using the Thor gem, its not taking the :aliases option . Examples : :aliases => "-f" ; full code :
[21:53:29] Melpaws: class_option :find , :aliases => "-f" , :desc => "find a comic in collection . Use quotes if longer than one word"
[21:53:29] Melpaws: desc "find" , "find a comic in our collection"
[21:53:40] Melpaws: any thing i'm missing?
[21:54:32] norc: Ox0dea: Crazy presentation. :)
[21:54:34] norc: Was that you?
[21:55:00] Ox0dea: Am I Charlie Somerville?
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[21:55:19] adaedra: Tu es Charlie ?
[21:55:38] norc: I wouldn't know.
[21:55:39] shevy: Dir.instance_methods(false).sort returns all instance methods of class Dir but how do I get all class methods of class Dir such as Dir.chdir()?
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[21:55:44] Ox0dea: norc: charliesome is here now and then.
[21:55:49] norc: Ah cool. :)
[21:55:59] Ox0dea: He's the fella what gave us eval.in.
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[21:56:19] adaedra: Praise him.
[21:56:53] Ox0dea: >> Dir.methods(false).sort # shevy
[21:56:54] ruboto: Ox0dea # => [:[], :chdir, :chroot, :delete, :entries, :exist?, :exists?, :foreach, :getwd, :glob, :home, :mkdir, ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470690)
[21:56:56] slash_quit: Melpaws: it'd be best to put code examples in a gist...the whole class would be nice
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[21:57:07] Ox0dea: Somebody needs to get a better feel for Ruby's object model. :P
[21:57:12] norc: I wonder whether the frozencore was backported
[21:57:22] Ox0dea: How do you mean?
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[21:57:33] norc: Ox0dea: You said it was added in 2.2
[21:57:38] shevy: ah yes, thanks
[21:57:42] slash_quit: Melpaws: i know it's just two lines, but it's really annoying to chase those two lines up the screen
[21:57:45] Ox0dea: norc: No, it was made impossible to play with in 2.2. :<
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[21:58:24] slash_quit: Melpaws: here's some thor usage to compare yours to https://github.com/rthbound/pay_dirt/blob/master/pay_dirt.thor
[21:58:50] norc: You mean just harder. As long as we have Fiddle, they can't hide everything.
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[22:00:04] Melpaws: i was looking for something similar to this
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[22:01:46] Ox0dea: norc: Here's how I get a reference to it on trunk: https://eval.in/470693
[22:02:10] norc: Ox0dea: Do you have a commit hash at hand for nobus patch?
[22:02:15] slash_quit: Melpaws: no problem, good luck have fun :)
[22:02:20] Ox0dea: norc: I'll find it.
[22:02:38] EasyCo: Hey team, what's the go with 'require'ing files at the bottom. Exhibit A: https://github.com/apotonick/cells/blob/master/lib/cell.rb
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[22:03:45] shevy: is there some trivial way to find out if a string is part of ruby core/stdlib or not? (or just core)... for instance, user can give "Dir" as input, which would be included like http://ruby-doc.org/core-2.2.3/Dir.html, but also "Dogs" which would not be included
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[22:05:54] norc: shevy: Yes.
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[22:06:55] Ox0dea: norc: Oh, I guess it was all the way back in 1.9.3? https://github.com/ruby/ruby/commit/16095eb
[22:07:22] Ox0dea: I vaguely recall seeing that he'd made some other modification which made it even harder to tinker with, but that might be a mismemory.
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[22:09:02] norc: Fair enough. Well, I think for now Ill stick and understand the parser and compiler better, before I move onto the object model.
[22:09:42] Ox0dea: I can't say I entirely understand why FrozenCore is even a thing.
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[22:10:10] norc: Im sure there is a japanese discussion about it somewhere on the ML.
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[22:10:38] Ox0dea: Doubtless, but why make Hash literals a secret method invocation and not let us bend it as we might? :/
[22:11:24] norc: Ox0dea: Honestly, with the sheer amount of monkey patching people can do already, that really does not limit the potential damage an idiot can do in any meaningful way.
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[22:11:52] iBloodLust: are there destructors in ruby?
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[22:12:48] eam: iBloodLust: there are finalizers - because ruby is GC there's no deterministic point at which objects are ever destroyed (if ever)
[22:12:51] norc: iBloodLust: Yes in the sense that you can define a callback that gets called when the garbage collector destroys it
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[22:13:02] norc: like eam just said.
[22:13:10] eam: destructor usually refers to a method invoked at a deterministic free() point
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[22:13:38] eam: iBloodLust: ruby hacks around the fallout from this by using block form and doing cleanup after a yield
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[22:14:00] norc: Ox0dea: This is also a creative way of leaving really toxic production code behind to give your (soon-to-be-ex) collegues real headaches. http://thedailywtf.com/articles/Disgruntled-Bomb-Java-Edition
[22:14:34] shevy: they use java so they deserve it
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[22:15:54] Ox0dea: http://i.imgur.com/Cc0cRtS.jpg
[22:15:54] eam: baweaver: in the object lifecycle, GC only addresses the resource of memory
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[22:16:14] eam: other resources, most common of which would be a descriptor, have to be freed manually
[22:16:42] eam: IO typically does do a close() in its finalizer, but it's irrelevant since it may never get called in time
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[22:17:05] shevy: Ox0dea is that an ermine?
[22:17:13] norc: Though Im sure Ox0dea has a pastie snippet around for free()ing arbitrary RObjects while making sure the GC does not collect it.
[22:17:19] eam: and you get hacks like the EAGAIN guards on descriptor allocating calls
[22:17:28] eam: which force a GC run
[22:17:42] Ox0dea: norc: banister did it.
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[22:17:54] Ox0dea: https://github.com/banister/free
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[22:20:48] norc: That's close enough.
[22:20:52] norc: Heading to bed though, gnite.
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[22:23:13] eam: I needed that under jruby
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[23:27:55] Daneel: i want to use the Method: Facter::Core::Execution#execute
[23:28:16] Daneel: but how to execute a command with varable ?
[23:28:42] Daneel: i tester #{var} but it does not looks to work
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[23:30:21] Daneel: something like this : Facter::Core::Execution.execute("/my/command -s #{var}")
[23:31:10] Ox0dea: Daneel: How come you want to use that instead of just `foo`?
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[23:31:36] Daneel: Ox0dea: because i have to use facter
[23:31:48] Daneel: Ox0dea: puppet
[23:32:12] Ox0dea: I'm not sure that's sufficient justification.
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[23:32:40] Daneel: tell me you don't know how to do
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[23:33:34] jhass: Daneel: "does not work" is not useful, detail what exactly you do, what exactly you expect and what exactly happens instead
[23:33:47] shevy: Ox0dea admit it, you don't believe that he has this problem :)
[23:34:39] adaedra: shevy: you seem to be calling a lot of people fakes this evening.
[23:34:45] Ox0dea: Whale, they're calling the thing properly, so maybe `var` isn't what they expect it to be.
[23:34:47] Daneel: i don't want to explain all puppet
[23:34:56] Daneel: i just don't know ruby
[23:35:07] Daneel: and try to get help on this dedicated channel
[23:35:16] nofxx: has joined #ruby
[23:35:35] adaedra: You may have better luck with puppet channel tho
[23:35:38] ruboto: Please join #puppet for help with it.
[23:35:41] Daneel: i have to use Facter::Core::Execution.execute method
[23:35:52] adaedra: I think puppet has some weird relation with ruby
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[23:36:05] Daneel: adaedra: perhaps
[23:36:40] jhass: Daneel: I didn't ask you to, I ask you to properly describe your issue
[23:36:53] CustosLimen: sorry noob question here: what does the => do ? (e.g. use Rack::Session::Cookie, :secret => ENV['RACK_COOKIE_SECRET'])
[23:37:02] Ox0dea: Daneel: All of this Facter boilerplate ends up invoking `out = %x{#{expanded_command}}.chomp`; your command does not seem sufficiently complex as to justify all this scaffolding.
[23:37:05] adaedra: CustosLimen: hash syntax
[23:37:16] Daneel: jhass: my issue is i don't how to writte a variable in this method
[23:37:18] jhass: CustosLimen: that's a hash literal, {:secret => ENV[...]}
[23:37:21] c355E3B: Anyone run into issues checking the class of a equalizer object?
[23:37:29] CustosLimen: adaedra, jhass thanks
[23:37:39] Ox0dea: Daneel: You are interpolating `var` correctly; the problem is in another castle.
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[23:38:07] jhass: Daneel: I'm sure you tried something. What exactly did you try (no pseudo stuff, copy paste the real thing) and describe the issue it causes
[23:38:20] Daneel: well is the ruby channel can help about ruby i'll ask on #puppet so
[23:38:41] Daneel: jhass: i paste code
[23:38:52] adaedra: we can help if the issue is correctly described, which is what we're trying to get at
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[23:39:35] nofxx: Ox0dea: played? fallout? With 3 I lost a month of life... trying to keep away of RPG
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[23:39:45] Ox0dea: nofxx: I've not.
[23:39:57] Ox0dea: I wish you all the best.
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[23:40:07] jhass: c355E3B: I didn't
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[23:40:30] Ox0dea: > Obsession is a young man's game, and my only excuse is that I never grew old.
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[23:40:47] Daneel: jhass: pastebin.com/brQMH5Fn
[23:40:48] ruboto: Daneel, we in #ruby do not like pastebin.com, I reposted your paste to gist for you: https://gist.github.com/f5b83003a5d13fe2e80b
[23:40:48] ruboto: pastebin.com loads slowly for most, has ads which are distracting and has terrible formatting.
[23:41:00] c355E3B: managing to get `[].is_a? array` to equal false.
[23:41:21] jhass: Daneel: that's part one, now what do you expect to happen and what happens instead
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[23:41:31] c355E3B: which would be hilarious in any other case
[23:41:50] jhass: >> [].is_a?(Array)
[23:41:51] ruboto: jhass # => true (https://eval.in/470755)
[23:41:57] jhass: >> [].is_a?(array)
[23:41:58] ruboto: jhass # => undefined local variable or method `array' for main:Object (NameError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470756)
[23:42:06] jhass: c355E3B: better be pedantic here
[23:42:21] Daneel: jhass: insteadof #{servername} i get the string in clientcert facter
[23:42:35] jhass: Daneel: "the string"?
[23:42:43] c355E3B: still false
[23:42:47] Daneel: the clientcert value is a string
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[23:43:08] jhass: Daneel: I don't follow what the issue is
[23:43:10] adaedra: c355E3B: what's [].class?
[23:43:24] jhass: c355E3B: also how about Array === [] ?
[23:43:31] Ox0dea: Daneel: Is that file executable?
[23:43:33] jhass: >> Array === []
[23:43:33] ruboto: jhass # => true (https://eval.in/470758)
[23:43:45] c355E3B: Array === [] #=> false
[23:43:46] Daneel: when this ruby code is executer by puppet the script shot it is mission the option
[23:43:54] Daneel: after the -s
[23:43:56] c355E3B: [].class? #=> Array
[23:44:05] Daneel: grrr wrong english
[23:44:23] Daneel: shout it is missing
[23:44:31] jhass: c355E3B: mh, [].is_a?([].class) and [].is_a?(::Array) ?
[23:45:05] jhass: Daneel: I'd guess servername is nil or ""
[23:45:14] Daneel: i think so
[23:45:16] c355E3B: jhass: thanks! both true
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[23:45:29] Daneel: jhass: but the facter value is not empty
[23:45:39] Ox0dea: Daneel: Is that file executable?
[23:45:39] jhass: c355E3B: so you have an Array class defined in the namespace you are in somwhere
[23:45:41] Daneel: jhass: it has a real value
[23:45:42] adaedra: Daneel: maybe print the variable using p to see if it's filled?
[23:46:03] c355E3B: jhass: afaik, no
[23:46:18] Daneel: Ox0dea: yes the shouted message is produced by it
[23:46:39] Ox0dea: Then what is the error?
[23:46:46] c355E3B: I think there is a library somewhere that is redefining it for me
[23:46:57] jhass: hrm, no Module#source_location ?
[23:47:29] jhass: c355E3B: Array.instance_methods(false).size ? and your Ruby version?
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[23:47:46] Daneel: the shouted message is shouted by the bash function getopt : option requires an argument -- 's'
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[23:47:57] jhass: c355E3B: in the context where [].is_a?(Array) is false of course)
[23:47:57] Ox0dea: Daneel: Then your variable is in fact empty or `nil`.
[23:48:10] Daneel: i written this script and i know if options are missing it about with this error message
[23:48:18] Daneel: Ox0dea: it is not
[23:48:23] jhass: Daneel: it is
[23:48:23] CustosLimen: so I define a function def position() ... end - and I want to call this from inside a module - I tried ::position() - but this does not work well
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[23:48:47] adaedra: Daneel: Maybe facter does not return the value correctly?
[23:49:03] Daneel: when i use the following command it return a value : facter clientcert
[23:49:07] c355E3B: jhass: found the bad bit, somebody did Array = LibClass at runtime
[23:49:25] jhass: c355E3B: welp
[23:49:33] Ox0dea: Daneel: Add `p servername` after Line 3; what does it print?
[23:49:51] Ox0dea: Please post the result verbatim.
[23:49:54] c355E3B: thanks for the sanity check, i appreciate it
[23:49:59] Daneel: Ox0dea: i check this
[23:50:35] Ox0dea: You are immune to assistance.
[23:51:15] Daneel: Ox0dea: it return nil
[23:51:54] adaedra: Are you sure facter waits for a symbol, and not a string?
[23:52:11] jhass: CustosLimen: "not well"? It works or it doesn't
[23:52:23] CustosLimen: let me make example
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[23:53:57] Daneel: adaedra: i use exactly the same method with the fact kernel
[23:54:07] Daneel: and all works as expected
[23:54:32] adaedra: We're getting at the limit between ruby territory and puppet territory here though.
[23:54:51] Ox0dea: Daneel: Ah, sorry; the language barrier got in the way; I thought you were saying you'd already checked.
[23:55:01] Ox0dea: >> "#{nil}" This explains your missing argument error.
[23:55:02] ruboto: Ox0dea # => /tmp/execpad-ba8ac160fd10/source-ba8ac160fd10:2: syntax error, unexpected tCONSTANT, expecting keywo ...check link for more (https://eval.in/470795)
[23:55:04] Daneel: well thankyou for your help
[23:55:06] Ox0dea: >> "#{nil}"
[23:55:07] ruboto: Ox0dea # => "" (https://eval.in/470796)
[23:55:19] adaedra: Daneel: Bon courage
[23:55:23] Ox0dea: Something must be slightly different about this script.
[23:56:13] Ox0dea: adaedra: I'd've guessed Italian; dunno why.
[23:57:18] adaedra: Ox0dea: well, the errors ticked me, and a simple nslookup on the ip gave it away.
[23:57:35] Ox0dea: Right, they seemed like Italian errors to my ears.
[23:58:15] Ox0dea: I know an Italian named Danilo as well.
[23:58:42] Daneel: Daneel is a name from science fiction
[23:59:10] adaedra: So no link with ???Daniel???? That was my guess.
[23:59:11] Daneel: Asimov is the Author
[23:59:30] Daneel: No but you are right i am french :D
[23:59:41] adaedra: Around Marseille, it seems.
[23:59:53] Daneel: this is my ip add