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#ruby - 19 March 2016

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[00:28:16] Nikesh: Aloha.. Where are sudo installed gems found?
[00:28:40] Radar: Nikesh: It depends(tm)
[00:28:43] Radar: Nikesh: Run "gem env"
[00:29:06] Radar: Or even "sudo gem env", just to be safe.
[00:29:10] Radar: "GEM PATHS" under that will tell you.
[00:29:18] Radar: Nikesh: How did you install Ruby in the first place?
[00:30:14] Nikesh: Radar: Ah thanks, taking a look. I didn't install it on this machine, it's a Vagrant box that someone else built
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[00:34:15] Nikesh: Thanks Radar, I found what I was looking for
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[01:22:43] bronson: I'm getting times from an FTP site... The times have my local time zone, but it's clear they're actually GMT.
[01:23:07] bronson: Can't figure out how to just force an existing Time to switch its zone, but leave everything else alone.
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[04:43:53] clorisu: whats the difference between a method and an action? (eg 'home' in 'def home end' inside a controller)
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[05:14:13] pipework: clorisu: An action is an instance method on a controller that is public. One could assume any defined methods on a controller class are actions, but they'd be wrong, which is sad. It's essentially a controller method that's usually routable.
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[05:21:47] clorisu: that went over my head pipework
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[05:56:27] xybre: clorisu: in Ruby, technically nothing, but "actions" are called by the Rails framework.
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[05:58:43] clorisu: xybre: so whats the difference between an action and a method?
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[06:06:38] ruby[bot]: -b *!*@gateway/web/freenode/ip.45.32.154.9$#ruby-banned
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[07:32:26] xybre: clorisu: actions are methods.
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[08:10:07] noService: hello there. whats THE unit test framework one ought to use?
[08:10:27] apeiros: minitest and rspec are the most popular
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[08:10:33] apeiros: ?toolbox noService
[08:10:33] ruby[bot]: noService: https://www.ruby-toolbox.com is a website which lists lots of gems, topically organized
[08:10:39] apeiros: ^ for the rest
[08:10:50] clorisu: xybre: theres no difference at all?
[08:10:56] noService: right. thx!
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[08:19:09] xybre: clorisu: Rails calls certain methods. It calls them "actions".
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[08:20:04] Ox0dea: clorisu: It's ill-advised to try to learn Rails before you have the rudiments of Ruby.
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[09:10:02] shevy: learn all the things!
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[10:05:43] apeiros: !fixcon ohaibbq_
[10:05:43] ruby[bot]: +bb ohaibbq_!*@*$#ruby-fix-your-connection *!*@2601:643:8100:fdf1:fcc9:395b:8974:eb45$#ruby-fix-your-connection
[10:05:43] ruby[bot]: ruby[bot] kicked ohaibbq_: join/part detected
[10:05:58] ruby[bot]: -b *MIGGER*!*@*$#ruby-banned
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[10:26:49] apeiros: I guess !fixcon needs wildcards :-|
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[10:39:32] shevy: hmm when we have a method such as: def foo(argument1, argument2)
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[10:39:52] shevy: is there a general name for variables like that?
[10:40:12] tobiasvl: shevy: what do you mean by "variables like that"
[10:40:58] sneep: method arguments?
[10:41:03] tobiasvl: to be pedantic (since you're askin): they're called parameters btw, not arguments ;)
[10:41:20] tobiasvl: parameters are in the method definition, arguments are the values that are passed to the method when called
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[10:41:53] nano-: drbrain: Humm.. just built rdoc from git, and installed via moving to pkg directory in rdoc after rake package, and issuing "gem install --local rdoc-0.borked.gem". I still see the problem of missing constants if I include both .c and .rb files.
[10:41:56] shevy: tobiasvl like when you use them inside the method
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[10:49:58] nano-: drbrain: not sure how to tell if it conflicts with my system wide installed rdoc though.
[10:50:45] Ox0dea: tobiasvl: And yet `args` is probably *the* most common parameter name.
[10:50:56] Ox0dea: That's not to say I don't agree with the distinction you cited above, mind.
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[11:29:43] nano-: drbrain: I just hacked my system wide installed one with your changes and that worked fine. Would be nice to know how to let the ~/.gem/ installed rdoc take precedence though.
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[11:51:18] djellemah: And just for fun, a pfind to go with pmap https://gist.github.com/djellemah/cbc1d350547f043c1b70
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[12:06:00] apeiros: good, no wildcard.
[12:06:02] apeiros: !fixcon ohaibbq
[12:06:05] ruby[bot]: +bbb $a:ohaibbq$#ruby-fix-your-connection ohaibbq!*@*$#ruby-fix-your-connection *!*@2601:643:8100:fdf1:c65:fdec:ac1f:ee74$#ruby-fix-your-connection
[12:06:06] ruby[bot]: ruby[bot] kicked ohaibbq: join/part detected
[12:06:08] ruby[bot]: -bbb *!*@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.141.47.72$#ruby-banned cwong_on_irc*!*@*$#ruby-fix-your-connection phreakocious!*@*
[12:07:21] TheCubeLord: but what is it
[12:07:29] Zarthus: fix connection
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[13:55:23] apeiros: +b *!~ohaibbq@*$#ruby-fix-your-connection
[13:55:24] ruby[bot]: -b senayar!*@*$#ruby-fix-your-connection
[13:55:26] apeiros: -o apeiros
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[14:03:04] thegunbuster: Hey I'm having trouble with a C extension. What happens is that on running repeatedly the performance goes downhill really fast
[14:03:16] thegunbuster: I'm not sure at all what is causing this
[14:03:31] thegunbuster: can someone explain if i link the built gem & source ?
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[14:04:30] thegunbuster: Gen: https://rubygems.org/gems/pcg_random Source: https://github.com/vaibhav-y/pcg-random
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[14:07:15] thegunbuster: There's some problem with the ::new_seed method
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[14:13:56] Hanmac: thegunbuster: is that your gem/C-Extension?
[14:14:51] thegunbuster: First time I'm writing one, so I'm unsure what I'm doing wrong
[14:15:24] Hanmac: thegunbuster: i think https://github.com/vaibhav-y/pcg-random/blob/master/ext/pcg_random/pcg_seed.c#L87-L98 might need to optimised, so you have the '+' and '*' stuff done in C without funcall, i think that would make it a bit faster
[14:16:15] thegunbuster: I agree, but I don't think that is the core problem (although it is one part of it)
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[14:16:34] thegunbuster: I'll paste a log of running trimes, just a sec
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[14:18:34] thegunbuster: Here's the gist: https://gist.github.com/vaibhav-y/2c06e87ee1f0d9cd0a05 The format is: method \n time
[14:19:06] thegunbuster: Sorry: method_name, output, time
[14:19:41] thegunbuster: It starts with comparable performance and then just dives into trenches unknown
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[14:20:00] thegunbuster: and does so repeatedly
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[14:22:46] Hanmac: hm my first idea is to find a way to keep the creation of ruby objects inside this functions at a minimum (Fixnum do not count) ... same goes for funcall ... means a good way would be to have the unpack in c too if possible
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[14:23:58] thegunbuster: ok, I'll try that first. I have an idea for replacing the funcalls but pack would be hard (since I can't call ruby's pack_unpack() )
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[14:37:15] Hanmac: libpcg (the original) is stupid as shit -.-
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[14:41:29] Hanmac: thegunbuster: how can i build the libpcg lib so it can be used with your ruby gem? because i get "relocation R_X86_64_PC32 against Symbol `pcg_advance_lcg_64' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC"
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[14:58:40] thegunbuster: hanmac, in pcg-c-0.94/src/Makefile
[14:58:52] thegunbuster: add -fPIC to the CFLAGS
[14:58:58] thegunbuster: like so: CFLAGS += -O3 -fPIC
[14:59:58] Hanmac: thegunbuster: yeah i got it working (shitty code) and now i need your "new_seed_bench.rb" for testings
[15:00:39] thegunbuster: sorry for skipping this detail in the build process.
[15:01:06] Hanmac: thegunbuster: its not your fault ... its the shitty pcg code
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[15:04:12] thegunbuster: I didn't use benchmark because it seemed to take too long to run. Here's the bench: https://gist.github.com/vaibhav-y/ae2b152e3bbbd93060d7
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[15:04:40] thegunbuster: I had to fallback to that ^ because it was taking so long to run 1k iterations :/
[15:05:39] thegunbuster: hanmac, how so is there some issue with the pcg_random lib itself? like some random numbers taking longer than others to get generated ?
[15:06:05] thegunbuster: I check the source for pcg, it's just reading /dev/random, so I don't think it should be slow at all D:
[15:07:02] Hanmac: thegunbuster: hm no i am not there yet, i only think that pcg (the c lib) is shitty to build
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[15:09:48] thegunbuster: it is, yes. very unconventional
[15:10:00] thegunbuster: to build, i.e.
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[15:54:54] arup_r: I have some API's from which I will pull data into my app.. What gem is good to use?
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[15:56:19] pipework: arup_r: Try base
[15:56:57] arup_r: I was looking at https://github.com/lostisland/faraday
[15:57:00] arup_r: base is a gem ?
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[15:59:30] arup_r: pipework: this one http://www.rubydoc.info/gems/base/0.0.2 ?
[15:59:54] pipework: arup_r: It was a joke. You have API's but haven't described the transport, the payloads, the serialization, anything about them.
[15:59:57] arup_r: nah, it is something different..
[16:00:02] pipework: Essentially, the thing you're looking for is Socket.
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[16:00:26] arup_r: yeah, I will pull JSON data
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[16:00:56] pipework: Okay so serilization. What about transport?
[16:02:42] pipework: arup_r: My favorite client to work with is Faraday.
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[16:09:45] slash_nick: pipework: i'm shocked :)
[16:09:53] slash_nick: not something a little more stdlib?
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[16:12:11] pipework: slash_nick: Net::HTTP requires patches for security that are a lot more hacky than the fixes for faraday which are, by and large, wholly compatible between versions of faraday. go figure.
[16:12:54] slash_nick: pipework: wow i think i'd like to learn more about that... standard net/http has unpatched vulnerabilities?
[16:13:03] slash_nick: or does it just leave you open to doing things in vulnerable ways
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[16:26:10] arup_r: slash_nick: pipework is right
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[16:27:36] pipework: Slow goings, but I'm working on a nice gem for configuring TLS in clients and servers for things like mutual auth and cert pinning. Others are supported too.
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[16:28:01] slash_nick: arup_r: i have no doubt... as i said, i'd like to learn more about that... did you find something?
[16:28:23] pipework: Too many of the people I've worked for ask for it. Actually every single one for more than a few years back, come to think about it.
[16:29:04] arup_r: slash_nick: I will use faraday
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[17:35:43] ceej: afternoon. is PStore thread safe? if you're running unicorn with multiple process, what happens if each process is trying to write to the same file?
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[17:37:37] ceej: I'm basically wanting to cache html templates that are created when the files are initially loaded. I'm just using File right now with flock
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[17:44:05] nohitall: hi, can someone explain to me what the p is in front if this example "p Resolv.getaddress "www.ruby-lang.org"" ?
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[17:44:51] ceej: try removing it and see if there's an output :)
[17:45:08] forcer: nohitall: Kernel::p, a method that prints its arguments to stdout: http://ruby-doc.org/core-2.2.2/Kernel.html#method-i-p
[17:45:37] nohitall: ceej: I dont have ruby installed and all online interpreter failed to load resolv :/
[17:45:41] nohitall: forcer: thanks
[17:46:06] nohitall: I never used ruby before, trying to understand a script
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[17:48:34] nohitall: require 'Resolv' should do the trick no?
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[17:48:52] al2o3-cr: nohitall: require 'resolv'
[17:49:12] nohitall: /usr/lib/ruby/2.1.0/rubygems/core_ext/kernel_require.rb:55:in `require': cannot load such file -- Resolv (LoadError)
[17:49:43] al2o3-cr: nohitall: lowercase 'R'
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[17:50:30] nohitall: tried that before, same error
[17:51:08] nohitall: require 'resolv'
[17:51:09] nohitall: p Resolv.getaddress "www.ruby-lang.org"
[17:51:15] nohitall: that should work?
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[17:52:21] nohitall: well no clue about online interpreter, maybe they dont allow require, I tried ideone & co, none worked
[17:52:45] al2o3-cr: nohitall: why don't you install ruby and play about with it?
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[17:54:00] nohitall: al2o3-cr: yea prbably will have to, thanks
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[18:27:25] nohitall: how can I use a ruby variable in a system shell command
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[18:27:37] adaedra: what did you try?
[18:27:40] nohitall: e.g. variable is a ID
[18:28:28] nohitall: didnt try yet, didnt find anything about that yet, only how to use '' and system
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[18:28:46] nohitall: need to put a variable in some curl
[18:28:55] adaedra: use string interpolation
[18:30:17] Papierkorb: or, when you're doing HTTP requests, one of the myriads of HTTP client gems
[18:30:20] nohitall: so e.g. system "curl -I http://blablalba.tlc/#{myvar}/xxx"
[18:30:22] nohitall: that'd work?
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[18:30:36] Papierkorb: unsafe, but yes
[18:30:37] adaedra: that should, try it?
[18:30:48] adaedra: but yeah, listen to Papierkorb, use a gem to do that.
[18:31:08] adaedra: If you're used to curl, look at curb
[18:31:32] nohitall: I only have to use ruby because some script I need uses it and I have to adapt it, dont want to spend days learning ruby, as shitty as that sounds, so thanks for the help
[18:31:34] Papierkorb: nohitall: have a look at the rest-client or the typhoeus gem. If all you want to do is doing a simple GET request and get its body, try rest-client first.
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[18:32:06] Papierkorb: nohitall: Well then, do you want to capture the output from curl, or just call it?
[18:32:19] nohitall: its API call
[18:32:25] Papierkorb: Then system() will be fine
[18:32:30] nohitall: yea that I figured
[18:33:30] nohitall: pretty sure there are better ways etc. but understanding all that probably takes a bit of time
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[19:03:41] TheCubeLord: what have i started
[19:04:21] TheCubeLord: ACTION drinks 
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[19:06:14] Ox0dea: Only you could say.
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[19:26:34] nohitall: ok I got weird issue with require
[19:26:58] nohitall: in some examples they use '' instead of "", also in my script it uses ''. but then ruby breaks and I have to replace with "" to make it work
[19:27:19] nohitall: does that make sense?
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[19:28:04] al2o3-cr: that souldn't matter
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[19:30:32] al2o3-cr: nohitall: could you gist your script to see context
[19:30:54] al2o3-cr: ?gist nohitall
[19:30:54] ruby[bot]: nohitall: https://gist.github.com - Multiple files, syntax highlighting, even automatically with matching filenames, can be edited
[19:34:37] nohitall: al2o3-cr: my mistake, nevermind
[19:35:18] nohitall: but weird to have 'resolv' but then use Resolv.
[19:35:34] nohitall: should be either or
[19:36:17] nohitall: especially funny since resolv.getaddress doesnt work
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[19:36:38] al2o3-cr: nohitall: resolve is the file Resolve is the class/module
[19:37:17] al2o3-cr: all classes/modules are constants
[19:37:18] nohitall: well coders might like it that way...
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[19:37:46] nohitall: well w/e, works fine
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[19:39:33] al2o3-cr: just out of curiosity, what did you do wrong?
[19:39:58] nohitall: did 2 changes at once
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[19:40:05] nohitall: which lead to wrong conclusion
[19:40:26] nohitall: changed R/r and '/" same time
[19:41:18] nohitall: got the attention span of a guppy
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[19:41:51] nohitall: whats a gem
[19:41:55] nohitall: like a lib?
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[19:42:25] shevy: nohitall yeah; ready for distribution to people
[19:42:57] nohitall: what I never understood with dev stuff, why everybody has to use different words for same things
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[19:44:25] forcer: Mainly because they're usually not really the *same* things, just similar. And A being similar to B, and B being similar to C, does not mean that A is similar to C.
[19:44:34] nohitall: so RubyGems is basically a manager for ruby libs aka gems
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[19:46:14] pipework: nohitall: It's a package manager, really.
[19:46:15] nohitall: probably similar to pip for python?
[19:46:20] nohitall: or its equivalent
[19:46:31] al2o3-cr: or luarocks etc
[19:46:35] pipework: There will be differences, but general behaviour and all.
[19:49:18] nohitall: well thanks for the help, pleasent communit here
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[19:59:17] forcer: I was looking for RSS feeds or feed aggregators about ruby, but found mainly RSS feed parsers and generators :-D planetrubyonrails seems dead, too. Are there any around still?
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[20:02:55] Ox0dea: forcer: http://rubyweekly.com/issues
[20:04:02] forcer: Ox0dea: Nice, thank you!
[20:04:08] Ox0dea: forcer: Sure thing. :)
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[20:37:08] a11: Is there anyway I could simplify this? https://gist.github.com/anonymous/d6037a4b4b7e278d7ff5
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[20:41:36] tobiasvl: a11: is "gay" something that contributes to feeling miserable?
[20:42:01] tobiasvl: not sure why the feelings are sets when they only contain unique feelings anyway
[20:42:30] a11: tabiasvl: sorry, it's something that people would use as an insult back from when i was in high school
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[20:45:08] a11: there won't be duplicates in either the criteria or input. that's why i chose to go with sets
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[20:47:38] a11: the order will matter in few cases, but not all
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[20:53:50] al2o3-cr: when was miserable a disease lol
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[20:55:27] al2o3-cr: probably call that feelings
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[21:12:15] a11: rubyists line up(vertically) hashes by colons or just by the beginning of the key?
[21:12:18] shevy: a11 that is also pretty terse
[21:12:27] shevy: you mean the new hash syntax?
[21:12:48] shevy: it does not allow for easy alignment
[21:13:02] shevy: you end up having some weird ' ' space characters all over the place just to indent properly
[21:13:26] adaedra: a11: beginning of the key.
[21:13:27] a11: ok so beginning of line
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[21:13:39] a11: shevy, adoedra: thanks
[21:14:20] al2o3-cr: ACTION takes a walk on the wild side
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[21:15:03] a11: shevy: new hash syntax..you mean : instead of hash rocket; did you mean the script was terse or my ? about hashes?
[21:15:10] pipework: a11: I usually just sort the keys automatically and align by the first character.
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[21:15:54] pipework: For hashes that span more than one line, I put the first key on a new line indented 2 spaces in and then follow with each after that, closing with a paren.
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[21:17:39] a11: pipework:ty
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[21:36:49] ruby_newbie: hello, is there a way in ruby to check if fork is running?
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[21:41:01] al2o3-cr: ruby_newbie: check the spoon or knife
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[21:43:30] al2o3-cr: ruby_newbie: jk there's a shit load of ways
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[21:46:45] Nuck: There was a blog post a few weeks ago talking about the fact that every gem seems to pull in their own HTTP library and it's stupid, but I can't find it right now. Anyone know the one I'm talking about
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[21:48:46] Nuck: If nobody knows the blog post, I'd be interested to hear thoughts on how to best handle HTTP in a gem without resorting to pulling in something like Typoheous or using a crappy wrapper like open-uri
[21:49:13] havenwood: nuck: mperham wrote an article recently along those lines about gem bloat
[21:49:17] havenwood: nuck: <3 HTTP.rb
[21:49:23] Nuck: havenwood: I think that might be the post I'm thinking of
[21:49:29] Nuck: I thought it was by somebody major
[21:49:46] havenwood: nuck: https://www.mikeperham.com/2016/02/09/kill-your-dependencies/
[21:49:53] RIK: i am currently having a debate about passwords in databases, and using HTTP/HTTPS.
[21:50:22] Nuck: rik: Always use MD5(password) without salt or pepper, and never use HTTPS. I redirect HTTPS to HTTP, just to be sure
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[21:50:45] Nuck: havenwood: Yep this is it. Thanks!
[21:50:47] RIK: i have a database, it's inecrypted on disk, and so stuff in it is secure.
[21:51:03] RIK: i have bcrypt'ed passwords stored in it, to auth the users.
[21:51:11] RIK: and, the users are on the far end of a network
[21:51:16] havenwood: ruby_newbie: Have any more context or just wondering generally?
[21:51:50] RIK: i'm debating throwing the site behind a certificate, and using HTTPS so that I can transmit the password unhashed, but still encrypted in flight.
[21:52:04] RIK: i think that's the right way.. bt it doesn't feel right.
[21:52:05] ruby_newbie: I have 2 subprocesses, one has to check if another one is still runing and respawn if necessary
[21:52:08] Nuck: rik: Well I mean, that's standard practice
[21:52:26] Nuck: If you hash on the client, you have to expose your pepper to the client *and* you can't reasonably salt it
[21:52:40] ruby_newbie: I'm using fork + exec for the one that I need to check
[21:52:42] Nuck: Plus you have less control over rate limiting of brute force attempts
[21:53:08] ruby_newbie: so I have a pid
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[21:54:22] Nuck: HTTPS is extremely secure (when configured properly, obviously)
[21:55:02] Nuck: At the very least it's probably better than anything you can come up with, since it's been battle-tested on the billions of websites which use it
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[21:55:34] havenwood: nuck: then send your MD5s via JWT (alg: 'none'): https://gist.github.com/havenwood/3b98192d6122a4c9b1a4
[21:56:28] Nuck: havenwood: heh it's weird reading ruby without parens on nested method calls
[21:56:31] havenwood: ruby_newbie: maybe worth taking a look at what eye or some of the other process monitors in Ruby are doing: https://github.com/kostya/eye
[21:56:32] RIK: i don't need to use http auth, i'm using SSL. I can just use an app-level pretty login. that'll work nicely.
[21:56:49] havenwood: nuck: Seattle style!
[21:57:08] RIK: havenwood: that's called Seattle style?
[21:57:11] havenwood: speaking of mperham: https://www.mikeperham.com/2014/09/22/dont-daemonize-your-daemons/
[21:57:43] Nuck: ^ I agree so much with this
[21:58:02] havenwood: rik: Not using parens unless it breaks the VM.
[21:58:03] Nuck: It was already good advice thanks to systemd, but now with Docker it's 500x more relevant
[21:58:30] al2o3-cr: why require 'base64' when pack('m') is encode64 and/&& pack('m0') is strict_encode64 go pack them boxes
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[21:59:00] Nuck: One command per docker container, logging to stdout/err, with all log aggregation handled by the Docker daemon
[21:59:14] Nuck: Self-forking daemons are awful for this
[22:00:27] ruby_newbie: thanks for help :)
[22:00:34] Nuck: al2o3-cr: Because it makes composition of daemons into a larger app easier
[22:00:36] al2o3-cr: ruby_newbie: np
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[22:01:15] al2o3-cr: nuck: depends the muscle of the machine
[22:01:28] Nuck: al2o3-cr: How so? Docker is barely-there
[22:01:45] al2o3-cr: and brainwave too///
[22:01:56] Nuck: It's all LXC containers, you don't need muscle for it
[22:02:41] Nuck: But the benefit of having all daemons log to stdout and respond to sigint and sighup in standard ways... it's huge!
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[22:03:06] al2o3-cr: nuck: joker
[22:03:34] forcer: nuck: So true.
[22:04:45] al2o3-cr: forcer: what's true
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[22:05:31] Nuck: By having a consistent interface, you enable simple declarative deployment
[22:06:18] forcer: nuck: A lot of the recommendations for 12factor apps are useful even outside of the web context. Not sure why that is not general best practice yet. :-)
[22:06:53] Nuck: forcer: I think one of the problems is that 12factor was, for a while, kinda hard to do without expensive stuff like Heroku
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[22:07:39] Nuck: The expansion of Docker (especially the recent improvements in their networking system) has brought Heroku-quality deployment to the masses
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[22:08:09] Nuck: I can now hook up AWS CodeDeploy w/ GitHub and have it do a downtimeless deploy of some docker container
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[22:08:21] Nuck: Boom, cheap Heroku alternative
[22:08:41] al2o3-cr: all these gems (bar) c extension is fucking possible in ruby alone. further deepness like the pacific ocean...
[22:08:52] Papierkorb: nuck: Whatever you do. Don't use Docker Swarm.
[22:08:58] Nuck: Papierkorb: ahaha why
[22:09:09] havenwood: al2o3-cr: I need RFC 4648 not RFC 2045. Also TIMTOWTDI and `[].pack('m').chomp("\n")` doesn't seem as clear to the reader.
[22:09:20] forcer: Though you can do some of that stuff - log to stdout, config via environment, etc. - quite easily with systemd already. I keep telling people writing new-style daemons for systemd is ten times easier than anything before, but I keep getting blank stares. :-D
[22:09:32] Papierkorb: nuck: Well it basically "connects" docker machines to act as one, right? Well, try to remove a node from that set up at runtime.
[22:09:51] Papierkorb: nuck: Or see what happens when a node just dies how long it takes docker swarm to notice
[22:09:59] Papierkorb: (Hint: It doesn't)
[22:10:01] Nuck: Papierkorb: But... this isn't the job of Docker Swarm
[22:10:14] Nuck: Papierkorb: Thsi is the job of the provider you hooked in with Docker Swarm lol
[22:10:44] al2o3-cr: havenwood: that's why you use .pack('m0')
[22:10:45] Nuck: (incidentally, I'm gonna be using ECS w/ docker-compose for deploying this app I'm working on)
[22:10:51] Papierkorb: nuck: Why on earth can I add a node, at runtime, but not remove one? There's nothing a provider can "fix" in there.
[22:11:03] havenwood: al2o3-cr: Give to Base64 what is Base64's!
[22:11:08] Papierkorb: Mesos/Marathon etc. don't use swarm
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[22:11:26] Nuck: Papierkorb: Eh, it's young. I'm sure they'll fix it soon enough. I mean, remember that until like December they didn't even have real networking support in Docker
[22:11:30] Nuck: It was all local-only
[22:12:29] Nuck: forcer: I've been pushing for systemd for years. But Docker is so much better for deployments. I can write a Dockerfile for a rails app in all of 1 line
[22:12:45] Papierkorb: nuck: Let's just say, with all of dockers faults, docker swarm is the most disappointing part of our deployment stack. Good thing it's not in production yet and we can actually wait
[22:13:05] al2o3-cr: havenwood: you tell me Base64.strict_encode64 == ["foo"].pack('m0')
[22:13:16] forcer: nuck: Yeah. You won't hear any counterargument to that from me :-D
[22:13:28] Papierkorb: Consul: Great. Docker: well .. don't look harsh and it will work (it may however eat your virtual memory, and your kittens, if you're not careful).
[22:14:33] Nuck: Papierkorb: Docker works great in my experience, as long as you avoid the recent additions. Compose is mature enough that I trust it, but Swarm is extremely young, and rather novel
[22:14:38] monoprotic: not my kittens!
[22:15:26] Nuck: I'll also admit that Docker is rather slow to develop things
[22:15:38] Nuck: Like how many years did it take for real multi-node networking to be developed?
[22:15:44] Papierkorb: Yeah the docker base stuff is *mostly* okay-ish (although they sometimes break the API). But their response time on severe issues is really through the roof
[22:15:49] Papierkorb: it's outside the solar system
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[22:16:17] Nuck: I dunno what the hell is up with them. Maybe because they chose a language like Go
[22:16:34] Nuck: Can't iterate as quickly because of it? I'm honestly at a loss
[22:16:38] Papierkorb: There are plenty issue tickets, like memory leak ones, which have threads longer than a novel from affected people, yet you're lucky to see even one response from a Docker Inc. person
[22:16:59] Nuck: I don't get why they use Go for *everything*
[22:17:06] Papierkorb: Me neither, really
[22:17:18] Nuck: Sure it's important for the docker daemon to be fast and concurrent, so Go or Erlang is a good fit
[22:17:29] Nuck: But did the client need to be in Go? Did Swarm?
[22:17:59] Papierkorb: tbh, C++ with boost::asio would've been a great fit
[22:18:18] Papierkorb: proven stability, battle tested, runs on pretty much anything.
[22:18:52] al2o3-cr: always use pack/unpack if encoding dissapates
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[22:19:36] Papierkorb: nuck: Consul is written too in Go, but tbh my guess is that the HashiCorp guy just wanted to get experience with Go, which atm is everywhere in "micro services" land for some weird reason
[22:19:52] Nuck: Well, Go is a good fit for microservices because static linking
[22:20:05] Nuck: There's no dependencies to install, just one binary
[22:20:25] Nuck: Go is honestly great for concurrent and distributed systems, since it's mostly a rehash of Erlang
[22:20:36] Papierkorb: This is the single best reason I've ever heard in favor of Go
[22:20:46] Papierkorb: But then, with containers, who cares?
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[22:21:08] Nuck: But I mean, Docker handles the containers so it kinda makes sense
[22:21:11] havenwood: al2o3-cr: Dissipates? Huh?
[22:21:24] Nuck: havenwood: I think al2o3-cr might be a markov chaining bot I'm not even sure
[22:21:38] al2o3-cr: havenwood: you know i tink
[22:22:22] Nuck: Papierkorb: Frankly I think Go was the right choice for the daemon, but wtf why not use Ruby or (dare I say it) Python for the client, for Swarm, for basically anything except the data-shuffling bits!?
[22:22:36] Papierkorb: ya I hear you
[22:22:39] Nuck: And I mean, how big of a team does Docker, Inc. have?
[22:22:40] al2o3-cr: havenwood: nice correction
[22:23:08] Papierkorb: nuck: A too small one for what they do with Docker Engine, Docker Swarm, Docker Machine, Docker kitchensink
[22:23:08] Nuck: It seems like a team of 5 could achieve the timeframes they have
[22:23:15] havenwood: al2o3-cr: I don't mean to correct, I don't understand what you mean.
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[22:23:56] Papierkorb: They just began working on Docker Datacenter something Cloud stuff. Why?!
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[22:24:12] al2o3-cr: havenwood: you#'ll never know
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[22:25:53] Nuck: Papierkorb: They're trying to build a whole ecosystem around Docker, but I think they may be going too wide. I think Docker+Compose+Swarm+Hub+Machine is all you really need
[22:26:09] Papierkorb: More than you need at that, yes
[22:26:38] Nuck: Docker is useless without Hub, Machine makes it viable to run Docker on OSX
[22:26:48] Papierkorb: I get why they're trying, but IMO having a few products which really work well and are stable and everything is superior than having tons of products which are lacking in the QA department
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[22:27:24] Papierkorb: nuck: Huh iirc Docker Machine was their linux distribution to quickly deploy swarm servers, Boot2Docker is afaik its own thing?
[22:27:36] Nuck: Papierkorb: boot2docker is the old name of docker-machine
[22:27:56] Nuck: docker-machine is also able to provision remote servers just as easily as it provisions a VM
[22:28:17] Nuck: Papierkorb: Just as docker-compose used to be called fig
[22:28:24] Nuck: I think docker-compose is in Ruby iirc
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[22:29:09] Nuck: Ah nope python
[22:29:16] Papierkorb: At least not Go
[22:29:26] Nuck: That's because fig was a third-party project originally :P
[22:29:32] Papierkorb: Probably yeah
[22:29:55] Nuck: It's kinda like how CouchDB managed to keep their git repo when they joined Apache instead of switching to SVN
[22:30:09] Nuck: Sometimes legacy is good
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[22:31:07] forcer: Switching from git to svn would count as cruel and unusual...
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[22:31:21] Nuck: haha yeah
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[22:49:30] mallu: can you please tell me why I am getting out 'true" instead of the parameter I passed in? https://gist.github.com/anonymous/59934caf63b090b82e55
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[22:54:33] adaedra: looks like ami is a boolean switch
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[22:55:30] adaedra: try using `opts.on('-aAMI', '--ami=AMI', 'AMI name')`
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[22:57:13] mallu: adaedra: that didn't work
[22:57:23] adaedra: How do you call your program?
[22:57:56] adaedra: Thank you shevy. Got anything even less relevant?
[22:58:15] mallu: ./aws_start_instance.rb -a ami-c11d1 -n 1
[22:59:04] mallu: adaedra: -n is returning 'true'
[22:59:20] mallu: so both -a and -n returning 'true'
[22:59:48] adaedra: I got it working your way with
[23:00:00] adaedra: opts.on('-a AMI', '--ami AMI', 'AMI name')
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[23:01:04] mallu: adaedra: why do I have to do -a AMI?
[23:01:26] adaedra: To tell it that the -a/--ami option takes an argument, otherwise it's just a boolean switch
[23:01:58] mallu: oh I see.. thank you
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